President Donald J. Trump

[ItsOver]

I agree, I like natural human diversity. I love the fact that there are still uncontacted stone age tribes in the Amazon and South Asia. I like exploring other cultures by visiting their countries, trying to learn their language, going off the beaten path and really trying to get a feel for who they are. I believe in judging people by their character rather than their skin color, sex or orientation. I'm very much a live and let live type of guy. But I do have limits, just as I would like to preserve tribal cultures in the Amazon, I'd also like to preserve European cultures which are just as ancient and have achieved levels of civilization unprecedented in human history. Multiculturalism works against that. I don't have any problems with immigration, but I do believe in integration into the culture that a person immigrates to. If I moved to Ecuador, I would learn Spanish and become an Ecuadorian. I think that's reasonable. I think it's also reasonable to ask that of people moving here. I do believe in religious freedom, but I also know that religions are not races, they are merely collections of ideas, some of which can be very bad and very violent and I think it's perfectly reasonable and sane to bar people from immigrating on that basis. I do not believe in importing other culture's social problems.

But, that's not the world we live in. In the US, immigration policy boils down to two special interests. On the Democrat side, they want to import voters so they can eventually take over the country and rule with a one party system with no viable challengers. They want a corrupt dictatorship of liberalism. On the Republican side, they want to import cheap labor that can be exploited by the corporations. Neither of these aims are in the interests of the people already here and neither are noble, in fact they are far scarier than anything that Donald Trump has said.

Great post, SciFi.  As YP would say, "spot on," although he'd probably be apopletic over your post.

[onan]

I agree, I like natural human diversity. I love the fact that there are still uncontacted stone age tribes in the Amazon and South Asia. I like exploring other cultures by visiting their countries, trying to learn their language, going off the beaten path and really trying to get a feel for who they are. I believe in judging people by their character rather than their skin color, sex or orientation. I'm very much a live and let live type of guy. But I do have limits, just as I would like to preserve tribal cultures in the Amazon, I'd also like to preserve European cultures which are just as ancient and have achieved levels of civilization unprecedented in human history. Multiculturalism works against that. I don't have any problems with immigration, but I do believe in integration into the culture that a person immigrates to. If I moved to Ecuador, I would learn Spanish and become an Ecuadorian. I think that's reasonable. I think it's also reasonable to ask that of people moving here. I do believe in religious freedom, but I also know that religions are not races, they are merely collections of ideas, some of which can be very bad and very violent and I think it's perfectly reasonable and sane to bar people from immigrating on that basis. I do not believe in importing other culture's social problems.

But, that's not the world we live in. In the US, immigration policy boils down to two special interests. On the Democrat side, they want to import voters so they can eventually take over the country and rule with a one party system with no viable challengers. They want a corrupt dictatorship of liberalism. On the Republican side, they want to import cheap labor that can be exploited by the corporations. Neither of these aims are in the interests of the people already here and neither are noble, in fact they are far scarier than anything that Donald Trump has said.

Actually, if life were only that simple. Of course, your choice to move to Ecuador would entail learning their customs, including the language. You're a stable and well educated person living under no political or social duress. Guess what is different regarding your standard of life and those that "want to vote for Hillary  :) ? Some here seem to think coming to the US is nothing but a cake walk with free everything once arrived.

But to the language thing, when the US entered WWI there were more than 700 newspapers printed in the US that were printed in the German language. Although, Germans immigrating to this country peaked in 1870. Given today's climate, especially with the rhetoric voiced by some here, if I were an illegal immigrant, I wouldn't open up to anyone to seek acceptance. I would just know my children were much less likely to be killed or forced into working for a drug cartel.

In reality, looking at immigration over the years, most first generation struggle to learn the language and often failed. The second generation are often bilingual and the third generation has difficulty speaking with their grandparents.

[GuerrillaUnReal]

https://youtu.be/2q6jHad-XG0

[Juan]

So (ha) the Ku Klux Klan, or Klan impersonators - its not clear which, showed up at a Trump rally and black Trump supporters beat the hell out of the Klansmen.  According to the media darlings I saw on the Sunday shows, this is distasteful and Trump's fault.  I guess this means Trump is worse than the Klan.

[albrecht]

Actually, if life were only that simple. Of course, your choice to move to Ecuador would entail learning their customs, including the language. You're a stable and well educated person living under no political or social duress. Guess what is different regarding your standard of life and those that "want to vote for Hillary  :) ? Some here seem to think coming to the US is nothing but a cake walk with free everything once arrived.

But to the language thing, when the US entered WWI there were more than 700 newspapers printed in the US that were printed in the German language. Although, Germans immigrating to this country peaked in 1870. Given today's climate, especially with the rhetoric voiced by some here, if I were an illegal immigrant, I wouldn't open up to anyone to seek acceptance. I would just know my children were much less likely to be killed or forced into working for a drug cartel.

In reality, looking at immigration over the years, most first generation struggle to learn the language and often failed. The second generation are often bilingual and the third generation has difficulty speaking with their grandparents.

What is weird, and really unbelievable, I don't recall hearing about, or seeing any evidence of in going through old papers, boxes, and archives, of my relatives back-when who emigrated receiving upon arrival free housing (even if temporary,) free transportation, free healthcare, free legal-aide, etc. What is more amazing I find no records of them receiving any EBT cards or a retro-active tax break. Or even voting ballots and all government forms and documents translated into their language! Crazy!
ps: warning about the dreams of Ecuador. They, like many countries aside from the USA, actually enforce their immigration, border, and VISA policy. And, horrible racists, the forms and documentation need to be translated to Spanish and notarized or apostilled and there is a fee and no free legal-aide! Racists.

[Value Of Pi]

So (ha) the Ku Klux Klan, or Klan impersonators - its not clear which, showed up at a Trump rally and black Trump supporters beat the hell out of the Klansmen.  According to the media darlings I saw on the Sunday shows, this is distasteful and Trump's fault.  I guess this means Trump is worse than the Klan.

Why even wonder which bunch is worse than the other? Why not just say the whole lot of them are a bunch of jerks for playing a role in Trump's reality show? Past time to stop being above it all.

I realize that some people are enjoying this spectacle (and let's face it, the mob appreciated the circuses, i.e. bloodsport, as much as the bread in ancient Rome), but at one point President Trump would certainly cause you to stop laughing while smiling and asking "Are you not entertained?"

[SciFiAuthor]

Actually, if life were only that simple. Of course, your choice to move to Ecuador would entail learning their customs, including the language. You're a stable and well educated person living under no political or social duress. Guess what is different regarding your standard of life and those that "want to vote for Hillary  :) ? Some here seem to think coming to the US is nothing but a cake walk with free everything once arrived.

It must be better than where they left or else they'd go back.

But to the language thing, when the US entered WWI there were more than 700 newspapers printed in the US that were printed in the German language. Although, Germans immigrating to this country peaked in 1870. Given today's climate, especially with the rhetoric voiced by some here, if I were an illegal immigrant, I wouldn't open up to anyone to seek acceptance. I would just know my children were much less likely to be killed or forced into working for a drug cartel.

Yes, which was somewhat of a problem. We had this huge pro-Hitler group of non-integrating Germans before WWII. That only changed because during the war, they were afraid of speaking or appearing German and they finally integrated. We, for a time, had imported one of Germany's cultural problems and we certainly did not want or need it and if things had gone a bit differently we'd have had a serious domestic problem on our hands.

As to the cartels and conditions that make people leave their home countries, I have no problem if they do it legally and integrate. But Mexico's inability to fix its corruption problems long enough to do something about the cartels is not a problem for us to fix through unfettered illegal immigration.

In reality, looking at immigration over the years, most first generation struggle to learn the language and often failed. The second generation are often bilingual and the third generation has difficulty speaking with their grandparents.

In the past, that's generally been correct. A lot of times, such as with my family, it was forced. The grandparents didn't want the kids to be bilingual. They wanted them to speak English and integrate. Had they not, they would not have faired well in the US. That's a bit different from today where we seem to be adopting Spanish as a second national language.

[albrecht]

It must be better than where they left or else they'd go back.

Yes, which was somewhat of a problem. We had this huge pro-Hitler group of non-integrating Germans before WWII. That only changed because during the war, they were afraid of speaking or appearing German and they finally integrated. We, for a time, had imported one of Germany's cultural problems and we certainly did not want or need it and if things had gone a bit differently we'd have had a serious domestic problem on our hands.

As to the cartels and conditions that make people leave their home countries, I have no problem if they do it legally and integrate. But Mexico's inability to fix its corruption problems long enough to do something about the cartels is not a problem for us to fix through unfettered illegal immigration.

In the past, that's generally been correct. A lot of times, such as with my family, it was forced. The grandparents didn't want the kids to be bilingual. They wanted them to speak English and integrate. Had they not, they would not have faired well in the US. That's a bit different from today where we seem to be adopting Spanish as a second national language.

We have a history of importing sectarian, criminal, or even disease problems from other countries and usually, after some time, old feuds end and people assimilate, in so far as, at least no more attacks, terrorism, etc on each other. We forget Fenians, anarchists, labor unrest, Catholics, Tong wars, and even now are somewhat whimsical about things like the various Italian or Jewish mafias. But we also had an immigration policy that was enforced and also based on logic. In 1965 that changed (thank you Hart, Celler, and Kennedy) and the doom of the nation, being what that was at least, was sealed. And now we don't even want a border; much less an immigration policy that is enforced. Unlike just about every other country on earth. Though, admittedly, many European countries are also being tasked with changing, or ignoring them, for the sake of "refugees." Odd that no "non-Western" country is demanded to ignore borders, take "refugees," change their culture to accommodate, grant amnesty, etc. And even many Islamic countries, save Turkey (and even then only some) aren't taking their brethren in so much need. And you should see how places like Mexico treat the illegals from countries south.

[chefist]

I'm in Tucson... I've heard from close friends the agitators are professional, paid...basically political sign throwers...

[onan]

It must be better than where they left or else they'd go back.

Yes, which was somewhat of a problem. We had this huge pro-Hitler group of non-integrating Germans before WWII. That only changed because during the war, they were afraid of speaking or appearing German and they finally integrated. We, for a time, had imported one of Germany's cultural problems and we certainly did not want or need it and if things had gone a bit differently we'd have had a serious domestic problem on our hands.

As to the cartels and conditions that make people leave their home countries, I have no problem if they do it legally and integrate. But Mexico's inability to fix its corruption problems long enough to do something about the cartels is not a problem for us to fix through unfettered illegal immigration.

In the past, that's generally been correct. A lot of times, such as with my family, it was forced. The grandparents didn't want the kids to be bilingual. They wanted them to speak English and integrate. Had they not, they would not have faired well in the US. That's a bit different from today where we seem to be adopting Spanish as a second national language.

Please don't be difficult just to be so. Of course it is better here for many and they choose to stay. If I lived in an area where local drug lords could kill me at any moment I would look for an out, and so would you.

Pro Hitler has nothing to do with the choice of learning another language taking more than the time you desire. No one learns another language in a few weeks. As the report states it obviously takes more than a few years to do so.

[RealCool Daddio]

Yes, he was very liberal regarding trade policy.

I have heard conservatives talking up how Reagan was the best president on the economy for decades, created all kinds of jobs, a golden age of sorts.  Now it turns out he did it all by implementing liberal economics policies.  Go figure.

[albrecht]

I have heard conservatives talking up how Reagan was the best president on the economy for decades, created all kinds of jobs, a golden age of sorts.  Now it turns out he did it all by implementing liberal economics policies.  Go figure.

Still waiting. You still on board with my idea to open I-35 for a direct route from Mexico to your Great White North and using merchant vessels for that Calais or Libya route for some "refugees?"

[GuerrillaUnReal]

I'm in Tucson... I've heard from close friends the agitators are professional, paid...basically political sign throwers...

Watching the false flag movement from the left and the media this election cycle has really revealed who's behind the curtain in this country.

[mikuthing01]

  I guess this means Trump is worse than the Klan.

Trump is pure evil and worse than Hitler hes not only a white supremacist hes also a black supremacist 

[SciFiAuthor]

I have heard conservatives talking up how Reagan was the best president on the economy for decades, created all kinds of jobs, a golden age of sorts.  Now it turns out he did it all by implementing liberal economics policies.  Go figure.

Historically for the GOP, they were liberal, yes. Another thing he was historically liberal on was immigration. Dwight Eisenhower he was not.

[Lt.Uhura]

I met an old veteran today who says he was "impressed" by Trump until he "put down the veterans" and now he says there is "no way" he would vote for him.  He said he has veteran friends who feel the same.  Being outspoken is one thing, but pissing off large portions of your electorate is foolish. 

[onan]

Historically for the GOP, they were liberal, yes. Another thing he was historically liberal on was immigration. Dwight Eisenhower he was not.

Let's be honest, the conservatives of today would scorn Eisenhower.

[SciFiAuthor]

Please don't be difficult just to be so. Of course it is better here for many and they choose to stay. If I lived in an area where local drug lords could kill me at any moment I would look for an out, and so would you.

If that were true, Ferguson would have no population and the refugees would be streaming out into the suburbs. That's not occurring. I think people move for economic reasons. And, again, I don't see why I have to pay for Mexico's corruption and drug problems. The Mexicans should be cleaning their own house, not leaving it.

Pro Hitler has nothing to do with the choice of learning another language taking more than the time you desire. No one learns another language in a few weeks. As the report states it obviously takes more than a few years to do so.

Took the Cajuns 250 years. While they aren't exactly a fifth column, they show that if you don't want to integrate, then it won't happen.

[SciFiAuthor]

Let's be honest, the conservatives of today would scorn Eisenhower.

They would, yes. Same with Goldwater.

[albrecht]

Let's be honest, the conservatives of today would scorn Eisenhower.

Operation Wetback? Warning of a military-industrial complex? Ok, maybe on the second, but more on Party; not the grass-roots.

[SciFiAuthor]

We have a history of importing sectarian, criminal, or even disease problems from other countries and usually, after some time, old feuds end and people assimilate, in so far as, at least no more attacks, terrorism, etc on each other. We forget Fenians, anarchists, labor unrest, Catholics, Tong wars, and even now are somewhat whimsical about things like the various Italian or Jewish mafias. But we also had an immigration policy that was enforced and also based on logic. In 1965 that changed (thank you Hart, Celler, and Kennedy) and the doom of the nation, being what that was at least, was sealed. And now we don't even want a border; much less an immigration policy that is enforced. Unlike just about every other country on earth. Though, admittedly, many European countries are also being tasked with changing, or ignoring them, for the sake of "refugees." Odd that no "non-Western" country is demanded to ignore borders, take "refugees," change their culture to accommodate, grant amnesty, etc. And even many Islamic countries, save Turkey (and even then only some) aren't taking their brethren in so much need. And you should see how places like Mexico treat the illegals from countries south.

It's because the various leftwing establishments in the western world realized that they could create one-party systems by importing voters.

[Juan]

Let's be honest, the conservatives of today would scorn Eisenhower.

As a geezer, I remember that conservatives at the time scorned Eisenhower.

[onan]

If that were true, Ferguson would have no population and the refugees would be streaming out into the suburbs. That's not occurring. I think people move for economic reasons. And, again, I don't see why I have to pay for Mexico's corruption and drug problems. The Mexicans should be cleaning their own house, not leaving it.

Took the Cajuns 250 years. While they aren't exactly a fifth column, they show that if you don't want to integrate, then it won't happen.

Look, if your doorstep has shit on it, it kind of comes with the territory. The problem is very complicated. It seems no matter what is offered to explain why somethings are as they are, instead of attempting a compromise, another complaint is thrown. It is a shame that some that come here are criminals. But the vast majority are not. And from what I read crime is down, including crime from illegal aliens. We are dealing with millions of people, there will always be something to bitch about. It is simple, whether you want to accept it or not, the US is not going to deport 11 million people. It isn't going to happen. Be as angry as you like, don't sleep tonight, if that helps. But we have 11 million, maybe more that are here and we need to find a solution that is pragmatic.

[onan]

As a geezer, I remember that conservatives at the time scorned Eisenhower.

You're not that much older than me, I think actually you are a wee bit younger. So maybe your parents didn't like him. Hell, Kennedy, now is thought of as much loved, but in the real world, not all that much.

[CornyCrow]

I have heard conservatives talking up how Reagan was the best president on the economy for decades, created all kinds of jobs, a golden age of sorts.  Now it turns out he did it all by implementing liberal economics policies.  Go figure.

He said the worst mistake he made as President was to grant amnesty to illegals.  People in the media seem to forget that.   Another thing he did was close down many publicly funded mental institutions.  Now we rely on these people to take their drugs, and when some do not, others get hurt. 

[RealCool Daddio]

Historically for the GOP, they were liberal, yes. Another thing he was historically liberal on was immigration. Dwight Eisenhower he was not.

So conservative policies are so bad for the nation, Republicans have had no choice but to adopt liberal economic strategies, and pretend they are their own.  That would mean that, fiscally speaking, the Democrats and Republicans are largely the same - on this we agree. The only difference would seem to be things like gay marriage, school prayer, fear of non-white people, and science denial.   I assume Hilary can expect your vote in November?

[GuerrillaUnReal]

Eisenhower doesn't get enough credit but he was a pretty brilliant President and arguably one of the most impressive Americans in history. I say this from my interpretation of history.

[CornyCrow]

I met an old veteran today who says he was "impressed" by Trump until he "put down the veterans" and now he says there is "no way" he would vote for him.  He said he has veteran friends who feel the same.  Being outspoken is one thing, but pissing off large portions of your electorate is foolish.

Yeah, and I fear that he's going to 'help business' by defunding the EPA.

[GuerrillaUnReal]

So conservative policies are so bad for the nation, Republicans have had no choice but to adopt liberal economic strategies, and pretend they are their own.  That would mean that, fiscally speaking, the Democrats and Republicans are largely the same - on this we agree. The only difference would seem to be things like gay marriage, school prayer, fear of non-white people, and science denial.   I assume Hilary can expect your vote in November?

Why is it bad to adapt good ideas? If I'm at a buffet where the steak looks good but the fish is making people violently sick, why do I have to have both? Liberals are more than capable of good ideas when they're not concentrating on their feelings or using marxist dogma to practice authoritarianism.

[Juan]

You're not that much older than me, I think actually you are a wee bit younger. So maybe your parents didn't like him. Hell, Kennedy, now is thought of as much loved, but in the real world, not all that much.

Actually, my father worshiped Eisenhower for liberating him from a Nazi prison camp.  Everyone else I knew was either a Stevenson Democrat (Eisenhower was a Nazi, Nixon wanted to restore the Holocaust) or a Bircher (Eisenhower and especially Roosevelt were Commies).