MH 370???

[GravitySucks]

They might have found the first wreckage from MH370...
https://en-maktoob.news.yahoo.com/mysterious-plane-wreckage-sparks-mh370-speculation-164936043--finance.html

[Jackstar]

[Uncle Duke]

They will be able fairly quickly to determine if the wing section found is from a 777, but unless there is a data plate or some serialized component(s) on/within the wreckage, then confirming it is from MH 370 is going to be difficult, if not impossible.  In the meantime, I expect forensic oceanographers will be burning up ones and zeros attempting to model currents/tides in an effort to back track an approximate impact site.

There is a photo of the found wing section on the BBC website that shows some rather odd petaling of the aluminum where it separated from the rest of the a/c.  I do not recall ever seeing damage like I see in the photo, but a good metallurgist can tell a good deal about impact parameters by looking at fracture patterns.  Not sure how extended salt water exposure to the fracture faces will affect metallurgical analysis, however.

[Jackstar]

"See that? It's from a 777. Now, sign this, or you'll lose your pension."


I am, of course, not stating that I believe this actual conversation has happened.

[nbirnes]

"See that? It's from a 777. Now, sign this, or you'll lose your pension."


I am, of course, not stating that I believe this actual conversation has happened.

It's time for another James Sanders/Bill Birnes show on Future Theater. Sumptin' happenin'.

[Jackstar]

Sumptin' happenin'.

Is it portallin'?

[Uncle Duke]

If this story has any legs, it would be great to hear Art or Steve interview a professional, maybe contact the International Society of Air Safety Investigators or the FAA's Civil Aeromedical Institute.

[Yorkshire pud]

If this story has any legs, it would be great to hear Art or Steve interview a professional, maybe contact the International Society of Air Safety Investigators or the FAA's Civil Aeromedical Institute.

A professional? You mean someone who knows what they're talking about and not someone who just trawls the net on CT websites and calls it work? It'll never be accepted!

[Sarcasm off]

[albrecht]

If this story has any legs, it would be great to hear Art or Steve interview a professional, maybe contact the International Society of Air Safety Investigators or the FAA's Civil Aeromedical Institute.

Also biologist (sorry, I don't know the proper term to the speciality) but there were various mollusks, etc on the wing, according to reports. I would imagine there are people who can figure out growth rates, where they came from, etc etc. I've seen some captivating, oddly, BBC shows on such stuff. So I'm sure they could tell some information based on what was living, growing, on the debris/partial-wing. Though "electronic green-fog" experts might be lacking

[Uncle Duke]

A professional? You mean someone who knows what they're talking about and not someone who just trawls the net on CT websites and calls it work? It'll never be accepted!

[Sarcasm off]

There are going to be people who want to hear conspiracy shows about this mishap, that's fine.  I was thinking more along the lines of a show where a mishap investigator explains the investigative processes and techniques in general,  discusses the various technical disciplines involved, explains protocols involving  international cooperation, etc.  The guest could also talk discuss/answer questions about this specific mishap, assuming the piece found on Reunion turns out to be from MH370 and leads to further discoveries.

[GeorgieForPresident2216]

If they can confirm the identity as a 777 wing flap, they should be able to catalogue the location of all other 777 wing flaps which have ever been manufactured and by elimination, identify this one as belonging to the missing MH370 flight.

[Yorkshire pud]

If they can confirm the identity as a 777 wing flap, they should be able to catalogue the location of all other 777 wing flaps which have ever been manufactured and by elimination, identify this one as belonging to the missing MH370 flight.

Yep. The flap section should have a unique id number if it's complete.

[Uncle Duke]

Yep. The flap section should have a unique id number if it's complete.

Back several years ago before I retired, the logistics guys in the aerospace industry started using the UID number to track components and subassemblies.  There were multiple criteria to define what items had to be assigned UIDs. The two most prevalent dealt with serialized items and components priced over a specified dollar value.  That amount was set at $5K initially, but there was talk of upping it since even relatively insignificant, commercial off-the-shelf items could cost $5K.  Don't know what that threshold is now, or at what level of assembly it is applied.  The loggi always seemed to do things in a somewhat arbitrary manner based on a cookbook/checklist mentality.

Reminds me of the old joke--

Why do logisticians smell bad?

So blind people can hate them too.

[albrecht]

Back several years ago before I retired, the logistics guys in the aerospace industry started using the UID number to track components and subassemblies.  There were multiple criteria to define what items had to be assigned UIDs. The two most prevalent dealt with serialized items and components priced over a specified dollar value.  That amount was set at $5K initially, but there was talk of upping it since even relatively insignificant, commercial off-the-shelf items could cost $5K.  Don't know what that threshold is now, or at what level of assembly it is applied.  The loggi always seemed to do things in a somewhat arbitrary manner based on a cookbook/checklist mentality.

Reminds me of the old joke--

Why do logisticians smell bad?

So blind people can hate them too.

Logistics wins wars and maintains businesses. I think some, if not all, of the tracking stuff is also related to the problem of counterfeit or stolen parts for planes, in addition to just maintaining supply efficiently.

I also think a biologist (or whatever) could help determine age of wing based on the mollusk etc build up on it, at least to some degree.

[Jackstar]

I heard that they said that they totes matched the numbers.

[Uncle Duke]

Logistics wins wars and maintains businesses. I think some, if not all, of the tracking stuff is also related to the problem of counterfeit or stolen parts for planes, in addition to just maintaining supply efficiently.

I also think a biologist (or whatever) could help determine age of wing based on the mollusk etc build up on it, at least to some degree.

There is a long standing, (mostly) good natured feud between loggi and engineers in DoD.  No argument logistics are important, and I had great respect for various disciplines within the logistics career field, especially the tech data guys and the maintainers.  Even those guys made fun of the supply types, or "box kickers and label lickers", however.  And loggi also tell jokes about engineers, but of course they're not funny.

Great point about counterfeit parts in the aerospace industry, I personally know of a couple instances where counterfeit parts in life support equipment resulted in deaths of military pilots.  UID was touted as a means to combat the problem, but the process' weakness in that regard involved components too small or delicate to physically place the identifier on the actual item.  Consider items like very  small precision measurement components or computer chips, for example.  In those cases, the UID went on the component packaging not the item itself.  The UID on the unit's container can be legit, but the item itself could still be a cheap knock-off.  Don't know how, or even if they found a solution to that issue.

[Yorkshire pud]

Engineers joke...

[Jackstar]

The passport was recovered by NYPD Detective Yuk H. Chin from a male passerby in a business suit, about 30 years old. The passerby left before being identified, while debris was falling from WTC 2. The tower collapsed shortly afterwards. The detective then gave the passport to the FBI on 9/11.
Page 40
http://www.9-11commission.gov/staff_statements/911_TerrTrav_Ch2.pdf

[Yorkshire pud]

I know you really want it to have landed at Diego Garcia, but it didn't. It didn't even crash land there. Or get transported by a UFO or through a portal..

[Jackstar]

I know you really want it to have landed at Diego Garcia, but it didn't. It didn't even crash land there. Or get transported by a UFO or through a portal..

dismissive hand-waving gestures

[Uncle Duke]

dismissive hand-waving gestures

Better than dismissive finger gestures.......

[Jackstar]

Better than dismissive finger gestures.......

There's finger involvement. But not for you, Uncle. You're a class act.

[Yorkshire pud]

There's finger involvement. But not for you, Uncle. You're a class act.

Ahh so it's the messenger rather than the message? Got it.

[Jackstar]

The passport was recovered by NYPD Detective Yuk H. Chin from a male passerby in a business suit, about 30 years old. The passerby left before being identified, while debris was falling from WTC 2. The tower collapsed shortly afterwards. The detective then gave the passport to the FBI on 9/11.
Page 40
http://www.9-11commission.gov/staff_statements/911_TerrTrav_Ch2.pdf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8C-e96m4730

Also, I love this bit from this hilariously overblown article: http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/30/opinions/abend-plane-debris-found/

This piece of the puzzle would at least dispel the conspiracy theory suggesting the airplane was flown to a remote terrorist-friendly nation.

Pineapple.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIheeOPxQCE

[Yorkshire pud]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8C-e96m4730



Also, I love this bit from this hilariously overblown article: http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/30/opinions/abend-plane-debris-found/


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIheeOPxQCE

When was the first time anyone gently suggested you shouldn't believe everything you think? Especially when you're using the font of fuck all knowledge?

[GeorgieForPresident2216]

Debris Is From Lost Jetliner, Malaysia Says

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/06/world/asia/mh370-wing-reunion.html?emc=edit_na_20150805&nlid=67386419&ref=headline

It's official, if you can consider the Prime Minister of Malaysia official.

[Yorkshire pud]

Debris Is From Lost Jetliner, Malaysia Says

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/06/world/asia/mh370-wing-reunion.html?emc=edit_na_20150805&nlid=67386419&ref=headline

It's official, if you can consider the Prime Minister of Malaysia official.

Strictly it was the engineers at Toulouse who confirmed it.

[Uncle Duke]

If this story has any legs, it would be great to hear Art or Steve interview a professional, maybe contact the International Society of Air Safety Investigators or the FAA's Civil Aeromedical Institute.

BBC is reporting the wing fixture found on Reunion Island has been confirmed as being from MH370.  Would again like to vote for Art or Steve to get a professional commercial aviation mishap investigator on as a guest.

[Yorkshire pud]

BBC is reporting the wing fixture found on Reunion Island has been confirmed as being from MH370.  Would again like to vote for Art or Steve to get a professional commercial aviation mishap investigator on as a guest.

The ocean currents from the western coast of Australia where it's suspected the aircraft ditched go north and west and then south near Madagascar hence when the north coast of Reunion is collecting the debris. It makes sense that anything that can float would go there, or thereabouts.

[GeorgieForPresident2216]

Reunion looks like a nice place.  Maybe I'll move there.