Obama's Going Full-on Mussolini After the Mid-Terms

[Ruteger]

Importing 100,000 Haitians - no problemo! We gots plenty jobs for everyone! Ebola? Nah, we gots that contained! Let's import more diseased illegals from Mexico including the guy who just murdered 2 cops in CA after being deported TWICE.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/10/26/officials-say-suspect-in-killings-california-deputies-was-deported-twice/

2 American children (that I know of) have been murdered by obama as a result of DHS human-trafficking of diseased illegals with enterovirus into this country and our school system.

This demon in the white house is gonna sucker-punch America in the gut after the mid-terms. Say goodbye to the country you grew up in (if you are over 40).

[Yorkshire pud]

Oh bless. QK, P.B and Sci Fi author's gym buddy is back. Still crazy after all this time.

[albrecht]

When every one was mentioning how the Obama propaganda posters and official photos reminded them of Soviet social-realism poster I was thinking, at the time, really that one photo most used was more Mussolini-esgue (the shot from sort of below trying to show a strong chin and looking "towards the future.") Who knows with this guy. I think he is all over the board on what he believes. In one belivies his biographies he has had weird, internal conflicts throughout his life and his bizarre upbringing, from what we know about it, could easily lead to a mental case or one easily swayed to various political, and otherwise, persuasions. Simply the whole broken family and odd experience of being raised as a Muslim in an Islamic country by a mixed-raced couple and step-father and taken care of by a cross-dressing nanny and then sent to be mentored by a prominent communist and pornographer whilst attend an elite private school in Hawaii could explain a lot psychologically! Throw in the drug abuse and later mentoring and experiences in the corrupt Chicago and that odd pastor. Who really knows what is in his head and any given moment!

[Yorkshire pud]

I don't suppose it's worth pointing out that Mussolini was a right wing fascist who was hung from a lamp post by Communists?

No, I don't suppose so.

Jeeze.

[VtaGeezer]

Say goodbye to the country you grew up in (if you are over 40).

Did that in January 2001.

[b_dubb]

boo hoo

[Kelt]

Overwrought hysteria still manages to give me lulz.

Lulz.

[GeorgieForPresident2216]

I don't suppose it's worth pointing out that Mussolini was a right wing fascist who was hung from a lamp post by Communists?

No, I don't suppose so.

Jeeze.

Sure, but Obama is a socialist communist fascist immigrant-loving-racist tyrant puppet dictator who is completely incapable of taking any action on his own while he completely rewrites the constitution and converts all his minions to Sharia law.  He's the Kwanza celebrating living embodiment of Adolph Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, Mohamed, and Jimmy Carter.  All this from a guy with a borderline normal IQ.

[albrecht]

Sure, but Obama is a socialist communist fascist immigrant-loving-racist tyrant puppet dictator who is completely incapable of taking any action on his own while he completely rewrites the constitution and converts all his minions to Sharia law.  He's the Kwanza celebrating living embodiment of Adolph Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, Mohamed, and Jimmy Carter.  All this from a guy with a borderline normal IQ.

Don't forget homosexual, or at least bi, if all the rumors are true.

[PB the Deplorable]

Sure, but Obama is a socialist communist fascist immigrant-loving-racist tyrant puppet dictator who is completely incapable of taking any action on his own while he completely rewrites the constitution and converts all his minions to Sharia law.  He's the Kwanza celebrating living embodiment of Adolph Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, Mohamed, and Jimmy Carter.  All this from a guy with a borderline normal IQ.

Meanwhile, President Jarrett is wrecking the country

[Yorkshire pud]

Sure, but Obama is a socialist communist fascist immigrant-loving-racist tyrant puppet dictator who is completely incapable of taking any action on his own while he completely rewrites the constitution and converts all his minions to Sharia law.  He's the Kwanza celebrating living embodiment of Adolph Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, Mohamed, and Jimmy Carter.  All this from a guy with a borderline normal IQ.

Yeah, but he's still not Mussolini is he? Because if he were it would screw up all things you've mentioned. I know Rutger is thicker than three week old cow shit dumped in a gravel pit left in the sun, but it scares me that he's the average level of US historical learning. He can't be a Commie Leftie, Maoist, Marxist, Stalinist and a right wing fascist according to them.

Unless he is?

[GeorgieForPresident2216]

Yeah, but he's still not Mussolini is he? Because if he were it would screw up all things you've mentioned. I know Rutger is thicker than three week old cow shit dumped in a gravel pit left in the sun, but it scares me that he's the average level of US historical learning. He can't be a Commie Leftie, Maoist, Marxist, Stalinist and a right wing fascist according to them.

Unless he is?

According to the right he's a complete oxymoron.  They've linked every possible evil to Obama no matter how the diatribe comes to contradict itself.  It becomes like a child's fairytale with the virtuous conservatives fighting the big bad wolf.  That's all I was trying to illustrate.

[RcCle]

At least Mussolini made the trains run on time..

[Yorkshire pud]

According to the right he's a complete oxymoron.  They've linked every possible evil to Obama no matter how the diatribe comes to contradict itself.  It becomes like a child's fairytale with the virtuous conservatives fighting the big bad wolf.  That's all I was trying to illustrate.

Oh I appreciate that fellow Commonwealthererer. I was trying to understand how the virtuous conservative's reasoning works, but fell into ritual facetiousness half way as I realised the futility of it..Square peg/ round hole..

[VtaGeezer]

Conservatives responding their leadership...

http://youtu.be/owXxuKsZdyE

[PB the Deplorable]

Yeah, but he's still not Mussolini is he?...

Well, first off the Fascists were and are Leftists.  As in the National Socialist Party in Germany.  As has been brought to your attention multiple times.  It was an easy step for Benny to go from the Socialist Party to found his own Fascist Party.

When people compare our own Dear Leader to Mussolini, it's more about the Dictatorship, the police state, the propaganda and cult of personality.  They aren't comparing the two policy for policy.

As far as those comparisons, within the system we have that's still standing Obama is still a wannabe compared to Mussolini - but it's clear to those with open eyes that he would if he could.

[Yorkshire pud]

Well, first off the Fascists were and are Leftists.  As in the National Socialist Party in Germany.  As has been brought to your attention multiple times.

Yeah but only by you. It would seriously screw up your narrative to think otherwise.

Hitler had Communists executed because he saw them as a threat...as did Mussolini. As I've told you several times National Socialists was a sop to sell to the mainly unemployed working class Germans to garner appeal; and it worked. The actual political philosophy wasn't socialist. If it were they wouldn't have picked out and murdered groups of people for persecution and murder.

If you still don't get it; read up on Geobbel's and Georing's attitude to socialists and Communism. Suffice to say it wasn't favourable.

Hitler had his former mentor killed by the SS. His mentor was a socialist and wanted to persue those principles. His protege thought otherwise. Hitler sided with Franco in the Spanish civil war.. Franco was fighting the Communists. George Orwell fought with the Communists.

And using your logic, North Korea is a fully fledged democracy because it has 'Democratic' in it's name.

[PB the Deplorable]

... Hitler had Communists executed because he saw them as a threat...as did Mussolini..

The Marxists want Big Totalitarian Government to own the means of production and tell everyone what to do in every aspect of their lives.  Or be shot. 

The Fascists are ok with the private sector owning and operating the means of production, but want Big Totalitarian Government to  regulate it so heavily that it's really just another arm of the government.  They also tell everyone what to do in every aspect of their lives.  Or be shot.

The two systems are siblings.  Mirror images.  They appeal to the same demographic - people with a Totalitarian Mindset.  Of course they've fought each other competing for the same followers.


So let's go over this again.  On one end of the spectrum is Totalitarianism.  On the other end of the spectrum is Anarchy - no government at all. 

And there, in the Center, are the people who want a small limited government to do those certain basic things that only government can do well.  But not a government large enough that it begins to take rights away, turns first into a dictatorship, then a totalitarian state.


So - vast, bureaucratic, highly oppressive government on one end, no government at all on the other end.  Various dictatorships are somewhere on the spectrum between the Center and the Totalitarians, depending on how bad they are and how much Liberty they allow.


I hope this helps.  Alas I doubt it will

... And using your logic, North Korea is a fully fledged democracy because it has 'Democratic' in it's name.

Actually, that would be using your logic

[pate]

According to the right he's a complete oxymoron.  They've linked every possible evil to Obama no matter how the diatribe comes to contradict itself.  It becomes like a child's fairytale with the virtuous conservatives fighting the big bad wolf.  That's all I was trying to illustrate.

That movie was a fairytale, just wasn't sure whose (sp)...

Blade Runner - Final scene, "Tears in Rain" Soliloquy (HD)

I repeat myself (ew)...

[Yorkshire pud]

The Marxists want Big Totalitarian Government to own the means of production and tell everyone what to do in every aspect of their lives.  Or be shot. 

You haven't a clue what you're talking about. Communists are anti government. The philosophy is the workers control of means of production..The workers, NOT the government. That you don't know the difference shows up your profound ignorance.

The Fascists are ok with the private sector owning and operating the means of production, but want Big Totalitarian Government to  regulate it so heavily that it's really just another arm of the government.  They also tell everyone what to do in every aspect of their lives.  Or be shot.

Really? Krupp was a huge German family steel conglomerate in WW2. They were still that when family members were arrested for war crimes. They weren't arrested for being part of a state run arm of the government, but as a separate entity.

The two systems are siblings.  Mirror images.  They appeal to the same demographic - people with a Totalitarian Mindset.  Of course they've fought each other competing for the same followers.

Agree.. But they do, and it's no surprise that both Stalin and Hitler admired Marx, however neither put his philosophies into practice. You know the phrase the bigger the lie the more it's believed? Both lied that they were giving socialism to their respective populations.

So let's go over this again.  On one end of the spectrum is Totalitarianism.  On the other end of the spectrum is Anarchy - no government at all. 

Not quite...one end is a totalitarian autocracy, the other is Communism..Whereby everyone has equal say, equal value not matter what. Stalin put down any and all perceptions of threat to his status. He had Communists (including those who put him in his position) put to death, imprisoned millions, and persecuted million more.

And there, in the Center, are the people who want a small limited government to do those certain basic things that only government can do well.  But not a government large enough that it begins to take rights away, turns first into a dictatorship, then a totalitarian state.

Communists want no government of any size. A logical extension of what you advocate. Equal rights and value for all.

So - vast, bureaucratic, highly oppressive government on one end, no government at all on the other end.  Various dictatorships are somewhere on the spectrum between the Center and the Totalitarians, depending on how bad they are and how much Liberty they allow.

Pretty much.

I hope this helps.  Alas I doubt it will


Actually, that would be using your logic

As opposed to your non sequitur?

You said the Nazis were socialist because they were called National Socialists. Presumably then you'd agree that NK is a democracy? Neither title reflects their true philosophies by the way.

[pate]

Jesus, Pud, I have a grand theory about Unicorn farts and how to capture those said emanations... I could easily write a treatise on the matter, couch it in terms of industry and such;  still won't make Unicorn farts real, or the method of capturing the same possible...

What a wonderful world it would be if I was as vague as both Marx then Hitler were...  I should pick up the pipe, I assume I could come up with the next 'answer' to all of life's societies' anyone at all's problems if I just toked told you more how to live your life...  It works for me, eh?

[Yorkshire pud]

Jesus, Pud, I have a grand theory about Unicorn farts and how to capture those said emanations... I could easily write a treatise on the matter, couch it in terms of industry and such;  still won't make Unicorn farts real, or the method of capturing the same possible...

What a wonderful world it would be if I was as vague as both Marx then Hitler were...  I should pick up the pipe, I assume I could come up with the next 'answer' to all of life's societies' anyone at all's problems if I just toked told you more how to live your life...  It works for me, eh?

Not saying how anyone should live their lives; But it doesn't make Hitler or Mussolini a socialist. Your round..mines a beer.

[pate]

Mussolini is the guy that claimed the trains would run on time, or he would change the schedules by fiat? 

Common myth, I am sure...

I guess neither myth makes either a socialist, or Marxist or at all influenced by either... just another pair lost to history for worshipping at the altar of Communism, or Marxism, whichever you wish to call it...

I got the beers bro, as a rich capitalist I owe you at least that...

[PB the Deplorable]

... As opposed to your non sequitur?...

Yes, saying the North Koreans are 'Democratic' because that's part of the name they've given their shitty little Fascist Marxist state is the same logic as saying Marxism is anti-government, production is owned by the workers, there's really no government at all, blah blah blah, because that's what Karl Marx claimed would happen. 

As opposed to what has happened in real life under the Marxists.

The exact same logic:  "Look, there it is on a piece of paper.  Surely it's true.  Pay no attention to reality".

You haven't a clue what you're talking about. Communists are anti government. The philosophy is the workers control of means of production..The workers, NOT the government. That you don't know the difference shows up your profound ignorance.

... Communists want no government of any size. A logical extension of what you advocate. Equal rights and value for all...

The reason it is important to refute this is because we have people insisting 'real' Marxism has never been tried.  Or they didn't have the right people implementing it.  Or too many mistakes were made.  Or it would have worked except those damn Capitalists kept interfering.  Or 'that' wasn't really Marxism.  And they want to keep on trying.  No matter how many lives are ruined, and no matter how many people must be murdered because they are 'in the way'.

So we get an Obama telling us 'we are the ones we've been waiting for'.  How is his little Fascist Marxist-wannabe Administration doing, as far as success and popularity?  I guess he didn't get it right either - you know, those damn Republicans and that damn outdated Constitution - so we wait for the next genius.

How much did Venezuela improve under Hugo Chavez?  Oh right, that wasn't an attempt at Marxism either.  Or did he die before it became a workers paradise.  I forget which one it is.

What you're not getting - and apparently never will - is a vast bureaucracy and a police state must be erected in order to implement it, because most people will never go along.  So we get Mao's China, Stalin's Russia, Castro's Cuba, Cambodia, North Korea, etc etc.  Instead of 'no government', the reality is there has to be a huge powerful government to insist on it, with force.

What you think it is is a mirage.  It's impossible on any kind of large scale.


Since you seem interested, you should read some more from Marx.  There was more to it than the short selected passages you quote from.  A lot more.  That's why he sat in the library for decades and wrote 10s of thousands of pages.

[pate]

Hey, argue against a brick wall all you want, until you or I can show up and witness as boat people to that country that it 'weren't so at all, gov' or some boat people from that country show up on our shores en masse, it's not going to ring true as an argument...


have some fun with it, I guess, we're doomed!

"You Will Be Assimilated!",Obama of Borg.

or more fun:

The Kinks - Do It Again

[Yorkshire pud]

Yes, saying the North Koreans are 'Democratic' because that's part of the name they've given their shitty little Fascist Marxist state is the same logic as saying Marxism is anti-government, production is owned by the workers, there's really no government at all, blah blah blah, because that's what Karl Marx claimed would happen. 

As opposed to what has happened in real life under the Marxists.

Exactly...they weren't Marxists. They weren't following what Marx advocated. If you drive at a 100mph and tell the cop you were really doing 50, it doesn't make you right. Stalin wasn't a Marxist, neither were those that followed, because each and every leader wasn't going to be one of the workers. They had an elite (in many cases a brutal paranoid and stupidly inefficient one), that isn't Marxism.

The exact same logic:  "Look, there it is on a piece of paper.  Surely it's true.  Pay no attention to reality".

See above

Since you seem interested, you should read some more from Marx.  There was more to it than the short selected passages you quote from.  A lot more.  That's why he sat in the library for decades and wrote 10s of thousands of pages.

Well if you claim to know more than I , you should be the one saying that Marxism hasn't been implemented, but a perverse antithesis of what Marx advocated;

The real reason why you're clutching at the wreckage of what you think is because basically Communism advocates the people being in control, and not the government; something you're always banging on about, but you have the dichotomy in not wanting to admit that dilemma of philosophy. We both know it, just be honest with yourself.

[pate]

Exactly...they weren't Marxists. They weren't following what Marx advocated. If you drive at a 100mph and tell the cop you were really doing 50, it doesn't make you right. Stalin wasn't a Marxist, neither were those that followed, because each and every leader wasn't going to be one of the workers. They had an elite (in many cases a brutal paranoid and stupidly inefficient one), that isn't Marxism.

See above


Well if you claim to know more than I , you should be the one saying that Marxism hasn't been implemented, but a perverse antithesis of what Marx advocated;

The real reason why you're clutching at the wreckage of what you think is because basically Communism advocates the people being in control, and not the government; something you're always banging on about, but you have the dichotomy in not wanting to admit that dilemma of philosophy. We both know it, just be honest with yourself.

I'm not the one you respond to in your defense of Marx/Stalin/Mao.

It seems to me one had a philosopy (or theory of political science) that hasn't yet been followed by any of the aspirants/expeiritants of the same...  so two or three have failed, and we only have to try again?  I have no idea but Immanuel Kant or somesuch as in that wonderful line of thought that is Marx...  Has anyone attempted to adopt or defend his line of thought, my dog barking seems to indicate a negative on that, or at least (should you find some sore sort of modern something that indicates a Kantian whichever that is/was...) implementation of an old ideal (don't get me wrong, we all want to live in the ideal world, just not particularly the one *I* or Marx would choose for us all...) so Mao and Stalin and Hitler and all these other failed common folk had it wrong, so now we are to put our hopes of global communism into who?  You?

Why david lynch's Dune when the SciFi channel's was far superior?

a few clips for Yeuh, a thousand deaths for Yeuh...

Dune Deleted Scene - Token of Respect

Dune - Alia Freaks out the Baron

both of those filmed and rejected by Lynch...

[Yorkshire pud]

I'm not the one you respond to in your defense of Marx/Stalin/Mao.

Nope; I'm not defending any of them. I'm saying none put into place Marx's philosophies; Marx wasn't in a position to do so though.

It seems to me one had a philosopy (or theory of political science) that hasn't yet been followed by any of the aspirants/expeiritants of the same...  so two or three have failed, and we only have to try again?

Nope; I'm not saying try again either. My own view is that Communism can never work, because we don't have the altruism as a society to live materially as equal to anyone else irrespective of what we do for a living. Nor do we want to take decisions on a collective basis, it's cumbersome, most of us basically cannot be bothered with the prospect of making decisions on a daily basis that everyone else will agree to. It's tiring and probably fruitless and inevitably end in conflict.

  I have no idea but Immanuel Kant or somesuch as in that wonderful line of thought that is Marx...  Has anyone attempted to adopt or defend his line of thought, my dog barking seems to indicate a negative on that, or at least (should you find some sore sort of modern something that indicates a Kantian whichever that is/was...) implementation of an old ideal (don't get me wrong, we all want to live in the ideal world, just not particularly the one *I* or Marx would choose for us all...) so Mao and Stalin and Hitler and all these other failed common folk had it wrong, so now we are to put our hopes of global communism into who?  You?

In the west we elect in various ways a government. No one method could be said to be perfect, and some are less perfect than others. We tend to vote against a candidate rather than for another. We frequently change our minds too. Global Communsim won't work for the reason I gave before.

[albrecht]

Yeah but only by you. It would seriously screw up your narrative to think otherwise.

Hitler had Communists executed because he saw them as a threat...as did Mussolini. As I've told you several times National Socialists was a sop to sell to the mainly unemployed working class Germans to garner appeal; and it worked. The actual political philosophy wasn't socialist. If it were they wouldn't have picked out and murdered groups of people for persecution and murder.

If you still don't get it; read up on Geobbel's and Georing's attitude to socialists and Communism. Suffice to say it wasn't favourable.

Hitler had his former mentor killed by the SS. His mentor was a socialist and wanted to persue those principles. His protege thought otherwise. Hitler sided with Franco in the Spanish civil war.. Franco was fighting the Communists. George Orwell fought with the Communists.

And using your logic, North Korea is a fully fledged democracy because it has 'Democratic' in it's name.

Hitler, like many autocrats, used ideology of the left initially to get a large base and then once in charge purged his party of those who believed in that more left, socialist style of government (Strasser types, the SA etc.) Same thing happens all the time in despotic regimes but especially in the more left orientated leaders (Stalin was, of course, infamous for this even eliminating the historical and photographic records- as much as he could- when people fell out of favor and were killed or sent to a gulag.)

Sure, your ideal of communism sounds nice (and such idealistic utopias can exist, at least for a short time, on small scales with homogeneous populations and shared beliefs, customs, and culture) but on a large scale not so much. And even the small groups tend to not stick around too long. And most of the times it has been tried by the Marxist-Leninists, etc etc it has ended up killing far, far more people than fascists regimes (like Hitler, Mussolini, Salazar, etc) either in total like with Stalin and Mao or in a percentage basis like Pol Pot etc. And remember the "communism" of your goal is the end only after (so the usual theory goes) by stages usually with some leaders (or group of leaders) to "help it along" to that end game. Never works out, though.

[Yorkshire pud]

Sure, your ideal of communism sounds nice (and such idealistic utopias can exist, at least for a short time, on small scales with homogeneous populations and shared beliefs, customs, and culture) but on a large scale not so much.

Does it? I'm not sure it would be nice. We're as a species selfish, all of us. Culture and convention has modified us over the centuries but if we were cavemen and women, we'd be looking after ourselves only. I think deep down we'll all revert back in the case of a major catastrophe.

And even the small groups tend to not stick around too long. And most of the times it has been tried by the Marxist-Leninists, etc etc it has ended up killing far, far more people than fascists regimes (like Hitler, Mussolini, Salazar, etc) either in total like with Stalin and Mao or in a percentage basis like Pol Pot etc. And remember the "communism" of your goal is the end only after (so the usual theory goes) by stages usually with some leaders (or group of leaders) to "help it along" to that end game. Never works out, though.

Exactly; The principle has no leaders of any focus..Sure you'd have various people who had areas of expertise helping the collective, but hey wouldn't carry any status above anyone else. And it hasn't and can never work because of the corrupt nature of despots.

Stalin told the people of the USSR that what they had was Communist utopia; Our western leaders told us that Stalin had a Communist state. Neither was true. Which is why many educated dissidents tried to escape from the USSR. They know it wasn't utopia. The poor peasants who worked in chronically inefficient factories building crap tractors that no-one would use outside the USSR and broke, and lived in abject poverty didn't know any better; all the time being told they had utopia. Looking on as Zils drove down  the separate roads in Moscow carrying 'comrades' who were more equal than they were.