ISIS

[albrecht]

      Japanese Red Army actions at Lod in May of '72 were far more frightening than this recent batch of beheadings.

Why isn't Aharon Katzir included on Steve Quayle's list of "dead microbiologists?"

Your point is well taken, when journalists are targeted then certainly the situation changes (at least in terms of what is reported and how it is reported.) But body-count wise ISIS has eclipsed JRA or anyone of that era and has a far larger membership. Interestingly most people seem to forget the close links, joint training, and joint operations between the radical Islamic types and the radical leftists. Still exists to this day (I recall some IRA guys caught down in Columbia a few years ago) but really did back in the day.

[Juan]

Remember Carlos the Jackal.
Eddie is right about what previous Jordanian action against terrorists brought the world. 

[Eddie Coyle]

Interestingly most people seem to forget the close links, joint training, and joint operations between the radical Islamic types and the radical leftists. Still exists to this day (I recall some IRA guys caught down in Columbia a few years ago) but really did back in the day.

       I think ISIS may be appealing to life's losers on both sides of the spectrum. Clearly, the modern updates of Baader-Meinhof or El Rukn types are natural allies who'd willingly do ISIS deeds in Europe/N America. But I also think the McVeigh/Nichols type of "patriot" are a threat as well. A few of these recent busts of (dumb)young white males getting caught in stings trying to join ISIS or Al Qaeda have shown them to be alienated whackos who dabbled in white supremacist movements before settling on getting even with jihad.

      Here's something I do find hope in. I heard recently that ISIS is reluctant to have non-Muslims  of any stripe do their dirty work, and are highly suspicious of those outside of the faith who "volunteer".

     

[Eddie Coyle]

Remember Carlos the Jackal.
Eddie is right about what previous Jordanian action against terrorists brought the world.

    I'd love to see Jordan kill 10,000 ISIS members in the blink of an eye. However, the response from the "Arab Street" will be a circle the wagons "This is genocide by a puppet for the Crusaders and Jews".

    Carlos the Jackal, 21 years now in captivity, and never a single attempt(of note) to have him freed via a hijacking/hostage taking.He must seethe at being viewed as old and out of the way.

[albrecht]

       I think ISIS may be appealing to life's losers on both sides of the spectrum. Clearly, the modern updates of Baader-Meinhof or El Rukn types are natural allies who'd willingly do ISIS deeds in Europe/N America. But I also think the McVeigh/Nichols type of "patriot" are a threat as well. A few of these recent busts of (dumb)young white males getting caught in stings trying to join ISIS or Al Qaeda have shown them to be alienated whackos who dabbled in white supremacist movements before settling on getting even with jihad.

      Here's something I do find hope in. I heard recently that ISIS is reluctant to have non-Muslims  of any stripe do their dirty work, and are highly suspicious of those outside of the faith who "volunteer".

     

Wading in deep waters here. There has been so many questions about German RAF (Baader-Meinhof) in addition to other radical leftist groups at the time (especially Red Brigades in Italy.) In some ways similar (maybe?) with some of the "terrorists" we have caught here in the US (both Muslim and radical whites) with much penetration of the organization by government organizations. By some accounts it could be said that the naive, radical folks (often students) got "used" by all sides (the Stasi and Soviets, the radical Arab groups, and even the "Western" powers) for their own agendas. (Or even, maybe, encouraged/facilitated to action by agents and then swept up and arrested to make good on "success" breaking up a terrorist. I hear agencies had operatives at Elohim City and possibly the OKC thing got missed due to ineptness and lack of communications?)

Good to hear that ISIS doesn't trust white-folks and is hesitant to use them in our countries, at least for now.

[Yorkshire pud]

Why isn't Aharon Katzir included on Steve Quayle's list of "dead microbiologists?"

Your point is well taken, when journalists are targeted then certainly the situation changes (at least in terms of what is reported and how it is reported.) But body-count wise ISIS has eclipsed JRA or anyone of that era and has a far larger membership. Interestingly most people seem to forget the close links, joint training, and joint operations between the radical Islamic types and the radical leftists. Still exists to this day (I recall some IRA guys caught down in Columbia a few years ago) but really did back in the day.

Yes, they were. But the PIRA were well financed by the Catholic terrorist sympathisers in the US. The PIRA have (Had) the dubious official record of most civilians killed at their hands-Catholic and Protestants. I suspect Isis (or whatever it calls itself today) has surpassed that considerably.

[Eddie Coyle]

Wading in deep waters here. There has been so many questions about German RAF (Baader-Meinhof) in addition to other radical leftist groups at the time (especially Red Brigades in Italy.) In some ways similar (maybe?) with some of the "terrorists" we have caught here in the US (both Muslim and radical whites) with much penetration of the organization by government organizations. By some accounts it could be said that the naive, radical folks (often students) got "used" by all sides (the Stasi and Soviets, the radical Arab groups, and even the "Western" powers) for their own agendas. (Or even, maybe, encouraged/facilitated to action by agents and then swept up and arrested to make good on "success" breaking up a terrorist. I hear agencies had operatives at Elohim City and possibly the OKC thing got missed due to ineptness and lack of communications?)

        The terrorism of, say 1967-1987, particularly in Italy, West Germany, Lebanon was so startingly byzantine that authors of seemingly every ideology can cite "evidence" of duplicity and maneuvering at every turn. From the Bologna train station bombing to the Oktoberfest bombing to Moro's assassination to Gemayel's assassination. Student movements/fledgling revolutionaries were always plagued by agent provocateurs. Each month brought a new faction. Who would then vanish just as fast. What's clear is that very few(practically none) of these outfits operated independently or sans a major(governmental?) benefactors. And when you have a Zbiggy Brzezinski still immensely proud of his actions in bringing down the USSR by helping create monsters we've been battling for a quarter century now, you really have to wonder.

[Eddie Coyle]

Yes, they were. But the PIRA were well financed by the Catholic terrorist sympathisers in the US. The PIRA have (Had) the dubious official record of most civilians killed at their hands-Catholic and Protestants.

   Who funded the UDA/UVF? Can't imagine the occupying forces ever took sides. Those Dublin and Monaghan bombings that were the worst one day atrocities of 1969-1998. And not carried out by Papists or Communists.

     NORAID wasn't 1/100th the terrorist sympathizer/provider your government was in Ulster and Eire. And your goverment's actions(8/9/71, 1/30/72) was more a catalyst for IRA recruitment than a jar on a bar in South Boston or Queens.


   

[VtaGeezer]

    I'd love to see Jordan kill 10,000 ISIS members in the blink of an eye. However, the response from the "Arab Street" will be a circle the wagons "This is genocide by a puppet for the Crusaders and Jews"....

Perhaps not.  The Hashemite Royal Family of Jordan is in the direct lineage of Mohammed, and has special status and prestige among Arab Muslims throughout the region. The Grand Mufti in Cairo, who's very influential with Sunnis, also called ISIL "the No. 1 enemy of Islam".  Perhaps most significant is that al-Kaseasbeh, the dead pilot, was a Bedouin and his savage killing has really pissed off the Bedouin tribals in ISIL-held territory.

[albrecht]

        The terrorism of, say 1967-1987, particularly in Italy, West Germany, Lebanon was so startingly byzantine that authors of seemingly every ideology can cite "evidence" of duplicity and maneuvering at every turn. From the Bologna train station bombing to the Oktoberfest bombing to Moro's assassination to Gemayel's assassination. Student movements/fledgling revolutionaries were always plagued by agent provocateurs. Each month brought a new faction. Who would then vanish just as fast. What's clear is that very few(practically none) of these outfits operated independently or sans a major(governmental?) benefactors. And when you have a Zbiggy Brzezinski still immensely proud of his actions in bringing down the USSR by helping create monsters we've been battling for a quarter century now, you really have to wonder.

Yeah, I don't think we will ever really "know" what the situation was back then. Fascinating though. As you say so Byzantine and so many governments and organizations involved on all "sides" and people who, now (or least in recent times) now in charge and want the past buried. I find it interesting though. So much seems untrue, the P2 Masonic Lodge stuff, but when you look into it you see much of the stuff is true- or at least there is "something" there. Especially with regard to the Vatican bank (remember Blackfriars hanging of Calvi?) Anyone who doubts I think Turkey is a great example of "deep state" politics because much (not all and still lots unclear) has come out in trials, arrests, and the news (Grey Wolves, Susurluk scandal, Ergenekon organization, CIA/NATO, Turkish/Bulgarian mafias, and even the current Fethullah Gülen vs Erdoğan situation.)

[Eddie Coyle]

Perhaps not.  The Hashemite Royal Family of Jordan is in the direct lineage of Mohammed, and has special status and prestige among Arab Muslims throughout the region. The Grand Mufti in Cairo, who's very influential with Sunnis, also called ISIL "the No. 1 enemy of Islam".  Perhaps most significant is that al-Kaseasbeh, the dead pilot, was a Bedouin and his savage killing has really pissed off the Bedouin tribals in ISIL-held territory.

    If this can become an internecine battle, where "The West" can hopefully display discipline and not get mired beyond where we already are...then that will be the most optimistic development I can imagine occurring.

    Our Rube Goldberg ways convince me that a flub awaits.

[Yorkshire pud]

   Who funded the UDA/UVF? Can't imagine the occupying forces ever took sides. Those Dublin and Monaghan bombings that were the worst one day atrocities of 1969-1998. And not carried out by Papists or Communists.

     NORAID wasn't 1/100th the terrorist sympathizer/provider your government was in Ulster and Eire. And your goverment's actions(8/9/71, 1/30/72) was more a catalyst for IRA recruitment than a jar on a bar in South Boston or Queens.


   

Occupying force? NI is part of GB. As for the rest. Well, HMG didn't ask PIRA to blow up shoppers and pubs or nail gun in the mouth and eyes 'transgressors'. So frankly the idea of catalyst is bollox. These were murdering psychopathic cunts. 

[Eddie Coyle]

Yeah, I don't think we will ever really "know" what the situation was back then. Fascinating though. As you say so Byzantine and so many governments and organizations involved on all "sides" and people who, now (or least in recent times) now in charge and want the past buried. I find it interesting though. So much seems untrue, the P2 Masonic Lodge stuff, but when you look into it you see much of the stuff is true- or at least there is "something" there. Especially with regard to the Vatican bank (remember Blackfriars hanging of Calvi?) Anyone who doubts I think Turkey is a great example of "deep state" politics because much (not all and still lots unclear) has come out in trials, arrests, and the news (Grey Wolves, Susurluk scandal, Ergenekon organization, CIA/NATO, Turkish/Bulgarian mafias, and even the current Fethullah Gülen vs Erdoğan situation.)

    Turkey, today, may be even hairier than it was in the 70's/80's. Which is really saying something.

      I'm fascinated by the goings on in Italy of 1960's-1980's. It begins in earnest with the Marshall Plan and the governments we propped up, but our fingerprints(and Mossad/KGB/Stasi) are all over the upheaval of 1968-1985. The Red Brigades became infamous killing Moro in '78, but unlike the RAF, they didn't seem to align themselves into grand projects like the Air France hijacking in '76. Their actions were within Italy and didn't garner huge international attention. The P2 stuff is interesting, do not know how true, but it's undeniable that the US were always concerned about Italy teetering and would go to certain lengths to make sure that "our guys" or those viewed as moderates like Moro were in (relative) power.

[Eddie Coyle]

These were murdering psychopathic cunts.

     Just the Taigs, right? Remember those 14 demonstrators that the IRA shot and killed at the Derry Bogside on Sunday Jan 30,1972? That was terrible. Vatican must have sent out their elite training units to carry out that mission.

     How about Lenny Murphy, Johnny Adair or Gusty Spence? Are they just misunderstood? They can't be murdering psychopathic cunts! That's reserved for the Whore of Rome's followers.

     A time machine to the Gordon Riots sounds like your wet dream.

[aldousburbank]

     Just the Taigs, right? Remember those 14 demonstrators that the IRA shot and killed at the Derry Bogside on Sunday Jan 30,1972? That was terrible. Vatican must have sent out their elite training units to carry out that mission.

     How about Lenny Murphy, Johnny Adair or Gusty Spence? Are they just misunderstood? They can't be murdering psychopathic cunts! That's reserved for the Whore of Rome's followers.

     A time machine to the Gordon Riots sounds like your wet dream.

Wow Eddie, you are fucking like next level yo!  I really really hated it when you were gone.

[Yorkshire pud]

     Just the Taigs, right? Remember those 14 demonstrators that the IRA shot and killed at the Derry Bogside on Sunday Jan 30,1972? That was terrible. Vatican must have sent out their elite training units to carry out that mission.

     How about Lenny Murphy, Johnny Adair or Gusty Spence? Are they just misunderstood? They can't be murdering psychopathic cunts! That's reserved for the Whore of Rome's followers.

     A time machine to the Gordon Riots sounds like your wet dream.

Tish tish....Okay, My mistake in not being clear. The PIRA are murdering cunts...as are the proddy cunts who killed civilians. I have personal reason to dislike the PIRA with a passion, and I wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire.


It would be interesting though if a section of (say) Alaska wanted to break away from the rest of the USA and decided the way forward was blowing up the Alaskan infrastructure, it population and politicians; and were financed by (say) Canada to that end.. I wonder what the USA as a whole might do to deal with that?

[VtaGeezer]

The references comparing the mostly tiny radical groups of the 60s/70s to ISIL with its operational army of around 30,000, substantial weapon resources, and holding an area the size of Belgium are puzzling and lack proportionality.  I don't think its unreasonable to say that ISIL blew past the combined acts of all the old radical groups, including the PIRA, in their first few months in Iraq in scale, brutality, and direct infliction of intimate terror on the populations it overtook.

[Eddie Coyle]

Tish tish....Okay, My mistake in not being clear. The PIRA are murdering cunts...as are the proddy cunts who killed civilians. I have personal reason to dislike the PIRA with a passion, and I wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire.


It would be interesting though if a section of (say) Alaska wanted to break away from the rest of the USA and decided the way forward was blowing up the Alaskan infrastructure, it population and politicians; and were financed by (say) Canada to that end.. I wonder what the USA as a whole might do to deal with that?

         Hold on. The Anglophilic US gov't sided with the British government wholeheartedly. Going back to Woodrow Wilson, and cracked down furiously on NORAID, with Irish Catholic pols like Ted Kennedy and Moynihan being the harshest critics.


        Blowing up infrastructure and it's population/pols? Uh, the troops were sent in the summer of '69 partially to protect Catholics from UVF sorts on their usual July rampage. Oh, Ulster is British...because King James I declared it so and thus began the planting. Excuse me for not being loyal to the Crown. I have lineage in Ulster(Tyrone) and believe it or not, they consider themselves Irish, not British. I know that makes them heathens...

         Funny, I figured you wouldn't mind Thatcherites like Neave getting blown apart.

[Eddie Coyle]

Wow Eddie, you are fucking like next level yo!  I really really hated it when you were gone.

    I'm sending you a high five and a cheers...and a hit off this bong.

[VtaGeezer]

Them Mooslums got nuttiin on the Brits and Irish when it comes to grudges.

[Marc.Knight]

Tish tish....Okay, My mistake in not being clear. The PIRA are murdering cunts...as are the proddy cunts who killed civilians. I have personal reason to dislike the PIRA with a passion, and I wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire.


It would be interesting though if a section of (say) Alaska wanted to break away from the rest of the USA and decided the way forward was blowing up the Alaskan infrastructure, it population and politicians; and were financed by (say) Canada to that end.. I wonder what the USA as a whole might do to deal with that?

Obama would say they are all lone wolves and disgruntled insurgents.

[aldousburbank]

It would be interesting though if a section of (say) Alaska wanted to break away from the rest of the USA and decided the way forward was blowing up the Alaskan infrastructure, it population and politicians; and were financed by (say) Canada

Here's what; We hold Rush (the world's greatest rock band, not the dik) and Neil Young hostage. What will Canada do then?

[attachimg=1]

[Eddie Coyle]

Them Mooslums got nuttiin on the Brits and Irish when it comes to grudges.

      Ironically, I think YP is an atheist like I am. So this tiff is nationalist instead of religious. Which is probably progess!

[Yorkshire pud]

         Hold on. The Anglophilic US gov't sided with the British government wholeheartedly. Going back to Woodrow Wilson, and cracked down furiously on NORAID, with Irish Catholic pols like Ted Kennedy and Moynihan being the harshest critics.


        Blowing up infrastructure and it's population/pols? Uh, the troops were sent in the summer of '69 partially to protect Catholics from UVF sorts on their usual July rampage. Oh, Ulster is British...because King James I declared it so and thus began the planting. Excuse me for not being loyal to the Crown. I have lineage in Ulster(Tyrone) and believe it or not, they consider themselves Irish, not British. I know that makes them heathens...

         Funny, I figured you wouldn't mind Thatcherites like Neave getting blown apart.

I got no pleasure from seeing Neave killed or the bomb in the Grand Hotel in Brighton. I cheered when Thatcher died, the damage her policies did to where I live and the surrounding area was devastating. But then, I think Tony Blair should stand as  a war criminal with Dubya. I'm quite ambivalent with politicians.

[Yorkshire pud]

Here's what; We hold Rush (the world's greatest rock band, not the dik) and Neil Young hostage. What will Canada do then?

[attachimg=1]

And KD Lang, Allison Crow, Celine Dion and Justi....on second thoughts.

[Eddie Coyle]

Here's what; We hold Rush (the world's greatest rock band, not the dik) and Neil Young hostage. What will Canada do then?

    A BTO tour to end all wars!

[aldousburbank]

    I'm sending you a high five and a cheers...and a hit off this bong.

Damn stoner

[Yorkshire pud]

Sobering reading.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-31147282

[Art_s Farts]

And KD Lang, Allison Crow, Celine Dion and Justi....on second thoughts.

Just leave April Wine alone. Those dudes are rollers who like to rock

[3OctaveFart]

American gets beheaded and Obama goes golfing. Jordanian is brutally murdered and their king says he will fly sorties.