President Donald J. Trump

[Dr. MD MD]

Everyone's been feeding at our trough, so they all get slapped down.

Upsetting the apple cart is chief among Trump's renegotiation strategies.

[analog kid]

Oh oh! There's going to be a new Dumbest Bellgabber soon.

No self-awareness.

How much dick do you suck to even exist here?

[Dr. MD MD]

No self-awareness.

How much dick do you suck to even exist here?

You're asking because you're really interested, aren't you?

[analog kid]

You're asking because you're really interested, aren't you?

Yes, I'm interested. How does an obnoxious piece of shit such as yourself avoid being banned? You got magic lips or something?

[Dr. MD MD]

Yes, I'm interested. How does an obnoxious piece of shit such as yourself avoid being banned? You got magic lips or something?

Banned?! Banned for what, snowflake?

[Metron2267]

Upsetting the apple cart is chief among Trump's renegotiation strategies.

The trade number is we export about 2% to Candadidia, they send us 25%.

So who feels the real pain?

They had time enough to go back to the NAFTA table and work a better deal, but Trudumb dug his pointy little heels in, oh well...

[Metron2267]

Banned?! Banned for what, snowflake?

Now, now, now...please recall your early Star Trek..."wrong thinking is punishable, right thinking will be as easily rewarded...you will find it an effective combination!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhPie6d1J7s

These lefties are drunk on control fantasies.

[Jackstar]

avoid being banned?

Wow, what could have gone wrong? I thought you had this covered. Pack your shit--you're fired.

[PB the Deplorable]

The trade number is we export about 2% to Candadidia, they send us 25%.

So who feels the real pain?...

The people the tariff tax is passed on to, the consumer

[PB the Deplorable]

Can we agree that status quo was not working?

If so, what other means of resetting these trade "deals" do you favor?...

Well, if I was going to decide to reset our trade policies and agreements, I would do the following.

- Decide what we need to be producing ourselves in the interests of national security.  Pretty much everything that goes into our war machine, and that we need to sustain ourselves.

- Look at what other countries do as far as unfair trade practices that hurt our producers.  Dumping.  Trade subsidies.  Blocking our products or unfairly restricting our exports.  That sort of thing.

- Decide which trade agreements need to be renegotiated or updated.  Be clear about what and why.  Look into which agreements and situations are lopsided and benefit other countries far more than they benefit us - while understanding we'd rather have lopsided agreements favoring poor third world countries than have them trading with China or Russia, buying our weapons instead of theirs, and employing their people there instead of having them come here. 

- Any other issues that are in the best interests of the US


From that, develop a policy.  Explain it.  Give our trading partners it would affect a head's up and see what they had to say.  Because they can retaliate, understand we're not going to get everything we want and it's going to be a process.  You know, act like a serious adult, instead of whatever it is Trump is usually acting like. 


Tariffs are not good economic policy.  All they do is drive up costs for everyone, and end up with a series of tit-for-tat escalations.  They should be used for political purposes only.  Historically it's the Democrats, pandering to the bloated unions who fund them, who typically stoop to this.  Keep in mind that for the most part Trump is a liberal Democrat who didn't go along with his former party's leftward tilt, and genuinely still wants what's best for the country.  Doesn't mean his liberal tendencies, to the extent he had hem, have been extinguished.  His approach is wrong on this, that's all.

[Metron2267]

The people the tariff tax is passed on to, the consumer

Which would be overwhelmingly - CANADIAN!

Do you think they're too thick to get that and will not relent?

[Metron2267]

Well, if I was going to decide to reset our trade policies and agreements, I would do the following.

- Decide what we need to be producing ourselves in the interests of national security.  Pretty much everything that goes into our war machine, and that we need to sustain ourselves.

So basic isolationism?

That appeals to me personally but it may not be all that workable long term.

- Look at what other countries do as far as unfair trade practices that hurt our producers.  Dumping.  Trade subsidies.  Blocking our products or unfairly restricting our exports.  That sort of thing.

That's pretty much what Trump is doing now...

- Decide which trade agreements need to be renegotiated or updated.  Be clear about what and why.  Look into which agreements and situations are lopsided and benefit other countries far more than they benefit us - while understanding we'd rather have lopsided agreements favoring poor third world countries than have them trading with China or Russia, buying our weapons instead of theirs, and employing their people there instead of having them come here. 

Sorry but no.

We can't set ourselves up as the low cost alternative trade resource for the third world, that's what's already cored our steel industry out.

- Any other issues that are in the best interests of the US


From that, develop a policy.  Explain it.  Give our trading partners it would affect a head's up and see what they had to say.  Because they can retaliate, understand we're not going to get everything we want and it's going to be a process.  You know, act like a serious adult, instead of whatever it is Trump is usually acting like. 

Please read the citations - that IS what we did.

They were put on notice and they jawboned us back in return.

So here we are - actual consequences.

Tariffs are not good economic policy.  All they do is drive up costs for everyone, and end up with a series of tit-for-tat escalations.  They should be used for political purposes only.  Historically it's the Democrats, pandering to the bloated unions who fund them, who typically stoop to this.  Keep in mind that for the most part Trump is a liberal Democrat who didn't go along with his former party's leftward tilt, and genuinely still wants what's best for the country.  Doesn't mean his liberal tendencies, to the extent he had hem, have been extinguished.  His approach is wrong on this, that's all.

These nations left him no other choice.

Forget what his political leanings may or may not be - they refused to renegotiate these trade deals and played him for political time and expense.

Now THEY pay the fucking price - and so be it!

[PB the Deplorable]

Which would be overwhelmingly - CANADIAN!

Do you think they're too thick to get that and will not relent?

Our prices go up on steel, aluminium, and everything downstream (shipping, because trucks and trains are made of steel; manufactured goods because machinery is made from steel; etc), their prices go up on items with new tariffs they import from us. 

Our trade with Canada, Mexico, and the EU countries drops, which means economic activity in general drops, which means jobs and profits drop.  Really, really great


What do you mean relent?  Relent on what?  They're going to demand what, that their government not retaliate?  Really?  The reaction will always be anger and a desire to punish US goods.  Even some consumers preferring to buy non-US goods not even affected by tariffs.

[Metron2267]

Our prices go up on steel, aluminium, and everything downstream (shipping, because trucks and trains are made of steel; manufactured goods because machinery is made from steel; etc), their prices go up on items with new tariffs they import from us.

Yes we are a net importer there, so there will be some pain, though not from Cana-DUH.

Our trade with Canada, Mexico, and the EU countries drops, which means economic activity in general drops, which means jobs and profits drop.  Really, really great

So you seriously want us to continue under punitive a trade agreements just to maintain status quo?

Why?

What do you mean relent?  Relent on what?

Redoing NAFTA and CAFTA and GATT.

They're going to demand what, that their government not retaliate?  Really?  The reaction will always be anger and a desire to punish US goods.  Even some consumers preferring to buy non-US goods not even affected by tariffs.

So your response is to stay mute and let these agreements continue to bleed us?

WHY?!?!?

[Jackstar]

So your response is to stay mute

So, you've heard of that.

[Dr. MD MD]

Now, now, now...please recall your early Star Trek..."wrong thinking is punishable, right thinking will be as easily rewarded...you will find it an effective combination!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhPie6d1J7s

These lefties are drunk on control fantasies.

LSD would be helpful then.

[Metron2267]

And I've heard of China's steel mill acquisitions around the world that allowed them to bypass tariffs on actual "made in China "steel...

The tariffs on imported steel now average 25%, but the anti-dumping tariffs on Chinese made steel often exceed 200%!

If anything China should be grateful to Trump, oddly enough.

[PB the Deplorable]

... So you seriously want us to continue under punitive a trade agreements just to maintain status quo?

Why?

... So your response is to stay mute and let these agreements continue to bleed us?

WHY?!?!?

I already told you what I'd do, and why

[Metron2267]

I already told you what I'd do, and why

But as you previously stated:

From that, develop a policy.  Explain it.  Give our trading partners it would affect a head's up and see what they had to say.  Because they can retaliate, understand we're not going to get everything we want and it's going to be a process.  You know, act like a serious adult, instead of whatever it is Trump is usually acting like. 

And that's just what Trump has done.

If these nations won't come back to the table he has to convince them its in their best interests. It's been over 4 months with nothing done at all.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2017/01/22/trump-makes-official-he-renegotiate-nafta/96918094/

Trump laid out his strategy after being sworn in last week. In a post on the White House website, the administration pledges in a statement to negotiate "tough and fair" trade agreements with the goal of creating more U.S. jobs as a top goal.

"This strategy starts by withdrawing from the Trans-Pacific Partnership and making certain that any new trade deals are in the interests of American workers," the statement says. "President Trump is committed to renegotiating NAFTA. If our partners refuse a renegotiation that gives American workers a fair deal, then the President will give notice of the United States’ intent to withdraw from NAFTA."
NAFTA, the free trade agreement between the U.S., Canada and Mexico, has contributed to a decline in U.S. manufacturing jobs, but it has led to massive automotive industry investment in Mexico and the growth of a supplier network there.

Nearly every automaker â€" both foreign and domestic â€" has built new plants in Mexico in recent years. Mexico has surpassed Canada in annual vehicle production.

[PB the Deplorable]

But as you previously stated:

And that's just what Trump has done...  It's been over 4 months with nothing done at all...

This article is from January.  2017. 

This is boilerplate from his inauguration, not him outlining plans four months ago (as you stated) that Canada, Mexico, and the EU have since rejected.  I'm not seeing anything specific, again just boilerplate generalisms.  If anyone is responsible for ''nothing done at all'', as far as negotiating - or even putting forth proposals - it's Donald Trump.

He didn't withdraw from NAFTA.  He didn't hold high level meetings with Mexico and Canada to try to revise it.  Or hold similar meetings with the EU to update our trade deals with them.  He didn't put tariffs on them in frustration after holding meetings and failing to reach an agreement.  He hasn't laid out his ideas of what changes we need to have.  He didn't do any of that.

Bluster and threats seem to work for him sometimes.  As bad as Clinton, Bush, and Obama were, he - and anyone else - would look good in comparison.  But he could do a lot better in some areas of policy by changing up his act once in awhile. 

I get that some of you guys think he can do no wrong, that everything he does is genius.  I also know very few people have any grasp whatsoever of economics - including the media and government officials - which means trying to explain why this is a remarkably poor idea is futile.  But can you at least link current articles with pertinent specific details if you are going to use them to support your comments?

[Metron2267]

This article is from January.  2017. 

I know, that was the point - they've had 4 months to digest and act on his trade policies.

This is boilerplate from his inauguration, not him outlining plans four months ago (as you stated) that Canada, Mexico, and the EU have since rejected.  I'm not seeing anything specific, again just boilerplate generalisms.  If anyone is responsible for ''nothing done at all'', as far as negotiating - or even putting forth proposals - it's Trump.

Do you want to deny the more recent coverage:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/04/27/trump-agrees-to-renegotiate-nafta-with-canada-mexico-leaders.html

President Trump and the leaders of Mexico and Canada agreed Wednesday to renegotiate the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA), the White House said â€" though Trump warned Thursday he’d be willing to “terminate” the pact if they can’t strike a “fair deal.” 

"It is my privilege to bring NAFTA up to date through renegotiation," Trump said in a statement late Wednesday. "It is an honor to deal with both [Mexican] President [Enrique] Peña Nieto and [Canadian] Prime Minister [Justin] Trudeau, and I believe that the end result will make all three countries stronger and better."

The White House added that Trump "agreed not to terminate NAFTA at this time" and that all three leaders ""agreed to proceed swiftly, according to their required internal procedures, to enable the renegotiation" of the trade deal to "the benefit of all three countries."

But Trump tweeted early Thursday that his cooperation is contingent on a fair deal being reached.

"I received calls from the President of Mexico and the Prime Minister of Canada asking to renegotiate NAFTA rather than terminate. I agreed," he tweeted. "... subject to the fact that if we do not reach a fair deal for all, we will then terminate NAFTA. Relationships are good-deal very possible!

He didn't withdraw from NAFTA.  He didn't hold high level meetings with Mexico and Canada to try to revise it.  Or hold similar meetings with the EU to update our trade deals with them.  He didn't put tariffs on them in frustration after failing to reach an agreement.  He hasn't laid out his ideas of what changes we need to have.  He didn't do any of that.

The article above says just the opposite.

Bluster and threats seem to work for him sometimes.  As bad as Clinton, Bush, and Obama were, he - and anyone else would look good in comparison.  But he could do a lot better in some areas of policy by changing his act up once in awhile.

It's not a style I personally favor, but it has generally worked for him.

And we'll see it again if Congress doesn't get the border wall done by the midterms - a full government shutdown has been whispered.

I get that some of you guys think he can do no wrong, that everything he does is genius.

I'm not one of "those guys" however.

I also know very few people have any grasp whatsoever of economics - including the media and government officials (and the ones who do follow the discredited Keynesian School) - which means explaining why this is a remarkably poor idea is futile.  But can you at least link current articles with pertinent specific details if you are going to use them to support your comments?

Did and done!

[PB the Deplorable]

I know, that was the point - they've had 4 months to digest and act on his trade policies.

Do you want to deny the more recent coverage:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/04/27/trump-agrees-to-renegotiate-nafta-with-canada-mexico-leaders.html

President Trump and the leaders of Mexico and Canada agreed Wednesday to renegotiate the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA), the White House said â€" though Trump warned Thursday he’d be willing to “terminate” the pact if they can’t strike a “fair deal.” 

"It is my privilege to bring NAFTA up to date through renegotiation," Trump said in a statement late Wednesday. "It is an honor to deal with both [Mexican] President [Enrique] Peña Nieto and [Canadian] Prime Minister [Justin] Trudeau, and I believe that the end result will make all three countries stronger and better."

The White House added that Trump "agreed not to terminate NAFTA at this time" and that all three leaders ""agreed to proceed swiftly, according to their required internal procedures, to enable the renegotiation" of the trade deal to "the benefit of all three countries."

But Trump tweeted early Thursday that his cooperation is contingent on a fair deal being reached.

"I received calls from the President of Mexico and the Prime Minister of Canada asking to renegotiate NAFTA rather than terminate. I agreed," he tweeted. "... subject to the fact that if we do not reach a fair deal for all, we will then terminate NAFTA. Relationships are good-deal very possible!


The article above says just the opposite.

It's not a style I personally favor, but it has generally worked for him.

And we'll see it again if Congress doesn't get the border wall done by the midterms - a full government shutdown has been whispered.


I'm not one of "those guys" however.

Did and done!

Ok, both these articles are from 2017.  You know this is 2018, right?

Saying they are willing to meet, talking about it, making speeches, photo ops, shaking hands, are all meaningless.  Actions matter.  This is Trump's agenda, not theirs.  That makes him the one to be proactive.  What steps has he taken to follow through?  What directives has he given his staff to implement talks?  What specifics has he or they laid out that need to be renegotiated?  What did he do to ensure the talks were moving along?

He didn't do any of it. 

Ok, I'm giving up now.  Feel free to post more year plus old speeches, threats, campaign promises, tweets, whatever you want.  If you think this is good policy, good for you.

[PB the Deplorable]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/how-trump%e2%80%99s-election-shook-obama-%e2%80%98what-if-we-were-wrong%e2%80%99/ar-AAy2e8N?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=ASUDHP 

I still can't get over this article.   Can anyone imagine the so-called main stream media publishing something favorable about Trump, let alone something as disgustingly cloying as this?  Of course not.  They may as well have insisted he be made a living saint.  (Not that this article is truly favorable, but the ''progressives'' who read it will certainly think it is).

“Sometimes I wonder whether I was 10 or 20 years too early,” he [Obama] said.  Yes, he went from ''we are the ones we've been waiting for'' to ''I was 20 years too early''.  Quite the ego for someone with no positive accomplishments he can point to in his life, despite being state senator, US Senator, and president.

The next shit show of an administration was ''stolen'' from them when Mrs Clinton lost, and they sure are angry.  ''Mr. Obama urged Prime Minister Justin Trudeau of Canada to take on a more vocal role defending the values they shared'' [Really?  This idiot?  This is who Obama sees as at his level?  He's right, but not for the reasons he thinks].  ''Chancellor Angela Merkel of Germany told Mr. Obama that she felt more obliged to run for another term because of Mr. Trump’s election to defend the liberal international order. When they parted for the final time, Ms. Merkel had a single tear in her eye. “She’s all alone,” Mr. Obama noted.''

What was Mrs Merkel talking about?  She's taken the lead in the invasion of the EU countries by the highly undesirable Moslems.  ''He [Obama] had read a column asserting that liberals had forgotten how important identity was to people and had promoted an empty cosmopolitan globalism that made many feel left behind. “Maybe we pushed too far,” Mr. Obama said. “Maybe people just want to fall back into their tribe.” 

To put it another way, the long-term goal of the Globalists is to destroy national identity, erase borders, and create a one-world left-wing fascist government, run by them.  Mrs Merkel is ''all alone'', as far as heads of governments, in continuing to push for this destruction within her own country.  Islam has been at war with Europe since their pedophile founder began their religion of death, so - for the Globalists - who better to import into the West on a massive scale to destroy it from within.     

[Metron2267]

Ok, both these articles are from 2017.  You know this is 2018, right?

Have these nations shown any willingness to negotiate since 2017?

Saying they are willing to meet, talking about it, making speeches, photo ops, shaking hands, are all meaningless.  Actions matter.  This is Trump's agenda, not theirs.  That makes him the one to be proactive.  What steps has he taken to follow through?  What directives has he given his staff to implement talks?  What specifics has he or they laid out that need to be renegotiated?  What did he do to ensure the talks were moving along?

He didn't do any of it.

You don't know that because you weren't in the loop, nor was I.

But:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/18/us/politics/nafta-renegotiation-trump.html

May 18, 2017

WASHINGTON â€" The Trump administration gave Congress official notice on Thursday that it plans to renegotiate Nafta but provided only the vaguest of hints about modest changes President Trump would seek to an agreement that he has called “the worst trade deal ever.”

In a brief letter to lawmakers, Robert Lighthizer, the newly confirmed United States trade representative, said the administration aimed to support economic growth and better-paying jobs through unspecified improvements to Nafta that would modernize the 23-year-old agreement. But the notice â€" a drastically scaled-back version of a draft the administration circulated this year â€" promised no major modifications of the sort that the president has hinted he will seek.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/07/17/trump-administration-outlines-goals-for-nafta-rewrite/

The Trump administration on Monday unveiled its goals for renegotiating the North American Free Trade Agreement, issuing a broad plan for how it hopes to rewrite the terms of trade and transform the U.S. economy for decades to come.

The document contained a broad list of objectives, including some goals that have been specifically championed by President Trump, as well as numerous provisions that echo the Trans Pacific Partnership, an Obama-era trade agreement that Trump has disparaged.

"You can say everybody’s objectives are in here," said Doreen Edelman, co-chair of the global business team at the law firm Baker Donelson. "I think the people that wrote the objectives wrote them in a way that will allow everybody to find a win."

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/17/trump-nafta-termination-negotiation.html

President Donald Trump speaks during an interview with Reuters at the White House in Washington, U.S., January 17, 2018.
President Donald Trump on Wednesday said that terminating the North American Free Trade Agreement would result in the "best deal" to revamp the 24-year-old trade pact with Canada and Mexico in favor of U.S. interests.

Lawmakers as well as agricultural and industrial groups have warned Trump not to quit NAFTA, but he said that may be the outcome.

"We're renegotiating NAFTA now. We'll see what happens. I may terminate NAFTA," Trump said in an interview with Reuters.

So he DID provide an upfront and timely warning after 16 months of non participation by these nations.

Ok, I'm giving up now.  Feel free to post more year plus old speeches, threats, campaign promises, tweets, whatever you want.  If you think this is good policy, good for you.

Feel free to show where these nations stepped up to the table and negotiated.

Put all the links you have here:

______________________________

[Dr. MD MD]

Have these nations shown any willingness to negotiate since 2017?

You don't know that because you weren't in the loop, nor was I.

But:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/18/us/politics/nafta-renegotiation-trump.html

May 18, 2017

WASHINGTON â€" The Trump administration gave Congress official notice on Thursday that it plans to renegotiate Nafta but provided only the vaguest of hints about modest changes President Trump would seek to an agreement that he has called “the worst trade deal ever.”

In a brief letter to lawmakers, Robert Lighthizer, the newly confirmed United States trade representative, said the administration aimed to support economic growth and better-paying jobs through unspecified improvements to Nafta that would modernize the 23-year-old agreement. But the notice â€" a drastically scaled-back version of a draft the administration circulated this year â€" promised no major modifications of the sort that the president has hinted he will seek.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/07/17/trump-administration-outlines-goals-for-nafta-rewrite/

The Trump administration on Monday unveiled its goals for renegotiating the North American Free Trade Agreement, issuing a broad plan for how it hopes to rewrite the terms of trade and transform the U.S. economy for decades to come.

The document contained a broad list of objectives, including some goals that have been specifically championed by President Trump, as well as numerous provisions that echo the Trans Pacific Partnership, an Obama-era trade agreement that Trump has disparaged.

"You can say everybody’s objectives are in here," said Doreen Edelman, co-chair of the global business team at the law firm Baker Donelson. "I think the people that wrote the objectives wrote them in a way that will allow everybody to find a win."

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/17/trump-nafta-termination-negotiation.html

President Donald Trump speaks during an interview with Reuters at the White House in Washington, U.S., January 17, 2018.
President Donald Trump on Wednesday said that terminating the North American Free Trade Agreement would result in the "best deal" to revamp the 24-year-old trade pact with Canada and Mexico in favor of U.S. interests.

Lawmakers as well as agricultural and industrial groups have warned Trump not to quit NAFTA, but he said that may be the outcome.

"We're renegotiating NAFTA now. We'll see what happens. I may terminate NAFTA," Trump said in an interview with Reuters.

So he DID provide an upfront and timely warning after 16 months of non participation by these nations.

Feel free to show where these nations stepped up to the table and negotiated.

Put all the links you have here:

______________________________

Just aknowledge that he's the smartest one and be done with it. It's what he's waiting for. I mean, can you imagine being old and conservative...in San Francisco?! That would make anyone crazy. 

[Metron2267]

Just aknowledge that he's the smartest one and be done with it. It's what he's waiting for. I mean, can you imagine being old and conservative...in San Francisco?! That would make anyone crazy. 

Indeed it would!

But he has a fair point on the distasteful nature of a trade and tariffs war.

It's just that there needs to be some acknowledgement that efforts to renegotiate were made and nothing has come from that.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/18/us/politics/nafta-renegotiation-trump.html

In a brief letter to lawmakers, Robert Lighthizer, the newly confirmed United States trade representative, said the administration aimed to support economic growth and better-paying jobs through unspecified improvements to Nafta that would modernize the 23-year-old agreement. But the notice â€" a drastically scaled-back version of a draft the administration circulated this year â€" promised no major modifications of the sort that the president has hinted he will seek.

Mr. Trump had threatened to withdraw completely from the agreement, only to relent in late April when the leaders of Canada and Mexico, the other parties to the deal, called and asked him to renegotiate instead. Sonny Perdue, his secretary of agriculture, also presented Mr. Trump with a map illustrating the potential negative consequences for American farmers if the deal were shut down.

“Today, President Trump fulfilled one of his key promises to the American people,” Mr. Lighthizer said on Thursday. “For years, politicians have called for the renegotiation of this agreement, but President Trump is the first to follow through with that promise.”
Mexican officials have been eager to begin the negotiations with an eye to concluding them before Mexico’s presidential election campaign begins next year.

Justin Trudeau, Canada’s prime minister, has repeatedly said that Canada welcomes the opportunity to renegotiate and modernize Nafta. “We are at an important juncture that offers us an opportunity to determine how we can best align Nafta to new realities â€" and integrate progressive, free and fair approaches to trade and investment,” Chrystia Freeland, the minister of foreign affairs, said Thursday.

[PB the Deplorable]

... "We're renegotiating NAFTA now. We'll see what happens. I may terminate NAFTA," Trump said in an interview with Reuters.

So he DID provide an upfront and timely warning after 16 months of non participation by these nations.

Feel free to show where these nations stepped up to the table and negotiated.

Put all the links you have here:

______________________________

I'm not seeing anything but talk in any of this from Trump.  You know, the way he likes to say how great everything is, how great everything's going to be, when there's nothing behind it.  Do we need Pud to remind you of his continual self aggrandizement?

If there had actually been high level substantial talks, we'd know about it - even if Trump had managed to not tweet out confidential details on a daily basis, the media who follow various officials around would report it.  And again, it's up to Trump to follow through and push this, not Canada and Mexico.

Like I said, I'm tired of talking about this.  Trump hasn't done a thing except his usual bluster, and you think that's all he's supposed to be doing before starting a trade war.  Feel free to think whatever you want, and hey, you even have Dr Dumb with you on this one.

[Metron2267]

I'm not seeing anything but talk in any of this from Trump.  You know, the way he likes to say how great everything is, how great everything's going to be, when there's nothing behind it.  Do we need Pud to remind you of his continual self aggrandizement?

And?

I know what his act is, everyone does.

If there had actually been high level substantial talks, we'd know about it - even if Trump had managed to not tweet out confidential details on a daily basis, the media who follow various officials around would report it.  And again, it's up to Trump to follow through and push this, not Canada and Mexico.

The apparent answer is that they've rebuffed or ignored him.

Like I said, I'm tired of talking about this.  Trump hasn't done a thing except his usual bluster, and you think that's all he's supposed to be doing before starting a trade war.  Feel free to think whatever you want, and hey, you even have Dr Dumb with you on this one.

You still haven't illustrated what other tools he has to get these nations back to the table.

[PB the Deplorable]

And?...

What do you mean 'and'?  The rest of it is the 'and' part

[PB the Deplorable]

... The apparent answer is that they've rebuffed or ignored him...

The apparent answer is everyone is waiting for him to lead.  Isn't it his idea, and isn't he the president?

How many legislative initiatives has he lead on with Congress to date?  Zero?  He came from the private sector, a family business where the president/CEO dictates everything and fires anyone who doesn't immediately go along.  That's exactly what he's done on his own with executive orders, and to a certain extent in dealing with North Korea.  But only so much can be done with EOs.  He's shown zero skills in leadership when he needs others within the administration to operate as a team (hence all the firings and resignations), or to push an agenda (hence the awful budget, and the failures to repeal ObamaCare). 

Why do you think it's any different with this, that he initiated dialogue and was rejected?  Answer:  he didn't