mexican militay chopper crosses into the united states and shoots @ border agent

[albrecht]

Oh okay.. scrap that then. You think the Soviet troops held off the Germans because they were bored and wanted something to do then? Don't mix up the troops with Stalin BTW.


But if we don't include those the British Empire lost 908 000 in WW1. USA 204 000. WW2 UK 383 800 (population nearly 48 million) USA 402 000 (pop 131 million.) USA lost 58000 in Vietnam but as that is a war many would sooner forget because it had mixed reviews, add that if you want.
That particular liberation caused birth defects with Agent Orange and shit.



I'm battling to understand why stories reach the news when they can come to you with the answer. Is that the case on this occasion then? Diversionary tactics?

True, but the USA didn't need to get involved in WWI or WWII, at least in the European theater where no national interest was really involved. Of course Russian troops fought! Of course British fought! And lost much, much more. They were fighting for their own homes, lands, and/or empires often on their home turf. Big difference than sending troops over to help out someone else in their fight versus defending your own home and fighting on your own land.

Having said that also to add to British help I will say that countries under British colonialism benefited greatly. Aside from South Africa, most nations that were colonialized by the Brit was very beneficial and countries were better off then and only went to hell after the British left (I won't say same, necessarily, for the Portuguese, German, and Belgians because they were far more cruel.) But the British left rule of law, language, infrastructure, schools, churches, etc in those countries. If you look at pictures place like India (Pakistan especially) under British rule vs now. Which looks more modern and safe?

[bateman]

Those powerful Mexicanos will be in Washington before we know it...

...I think there's a few people on this board would be conflicted between their uber-patriotism and their hate of Obama.

They'd be like a computer caught in an infinite loop, right up until their heads exploded.

Funny you should say that... http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/210810-immigration-group-plans-protest-in-house-office-building

[Kelt]

The Brits come in second, for sure.

Yeah.. k... anything you think, Sparky.

[albrecht]

Funny you should say that... http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/210810-immigration-group-plans-protest-in-house-office-building

And this whole thing about Pelosi going down to the border (with an armed security detail I'm sure) to greet the invading hordes? Insanity. Just today more diseases were announced in Mexico (and moving north with the illegals.) This time it is chikungunya. This in addition to the swine flu strains and countless other diseases spreading into the US on the backs of illegals. Why would this President or Pelosi actually welcome child-molesters, rapists, and who knows what else into the country? It can't be simply about votes but a more nefarious agenda.

[bateman]

And this whole thing about Pelosi going down to the border (with an armed security detail I'm sure) to greet the invading hordes? Insanity. Just today more diseases were announced in Mexico (and moving north with the illegals.) This time it is chikungunya. This in addition to the swine flu strains and countless other diseases spreading into the US on the backs of illegals. Why would this President or Pelosi actually welcome child-molesters, rapists, and who knows what else into the country? It can't be simply about votes but a more nefarious agenda.

Well if she's training for a second career as a Wal-Mart greeter, I wholeheartedly endorse.

As far as diseases, yup, all that and more.

“I’ve talked to border patrol down in McAllen. They’ve seen TB; they’ve seen chicken pox; they’ve seen scabies. And according to Border Patrol, 4 or 5 of their agents have tested positive for those diseases.”

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2014/06/27/report-border-patrol-looking-to-house-immigrants-in-abandoned-buildings-along-rio-grande/

[ItsOver]

Meanwhile, back in Minnesooooota.

http://wwlp.com/2014/06/27/pres-obama-to-speak-about-the-economy/

Might as well just burn Congress down.  Right, Barry? :

[Yorkshire pud]

True, but the USA didn't need to get involved in WWI or WWII, at least in the European theater where no national interest was really involved.

I would never ever dismiss the US troops (and the many other nations) who fought in WW1 and 2 on behalf of the UK. I think it's humbling that there are many monuments in the UK that have been erected by the locals commemorating American sacrifices, notably bomber crews. One such crew lost their lives in Sheffield on a flight returning from a raid.

The whole story (if you look it up) is a testament to the incredible bravery of what really were kids.

Ironic name of the aircraft considering the topic of this thread.

http://aircrashsites.co.uk/air-crash-sites-5/usaaf-b-17-42-31322-mi-amigo-endcliffe-park-sheffield-2/

http://www.thestar.co.uk/news/nostalgia/retro-the-10-amigos-who-fell-from-the-sky-1-6448835

http://h2g2.com/edited_entry/A7563783

Crew;
First Lieutenant John Glennon Krieghauser, pilot.
Second Lieutenant Lyle J Curtis, co-pilot
Second Lieutenant John W Humphrey, navigator
Second Lieutenant Melchor Hernandez, bombardier
Staff Sergeant Robert E Mayfield, radio operator
Staff Sergeant Harry W Estabrooks, engineer / top turret gunner
Sergeant Charles H Tuttle, ball-turret gunner
Sergeant Maurice O Robbins, tail gunner
Sergeant Vito R Ambrosio, right waist gunner
Muster Sergeant George U Williams, left waist gunner

But as Kelt says. If some bald statements are to be made, it's worthwhile making sure first.

[b_dubb]

Funny how we left them a sovereign nation and didn't confiscate their oil fields.  Also funny how they sell over half their oil to China.  You'd think a greedy country like the USA would just keep that oil for ourselves.  Ya know, since we're not into liberating people or anything.

Do you really think we spend hundreds of billions of dollars to free people?

[Kelt]

Do you really think we spend hundreds of billions of dollars to free people?

Secure their resources, and sell them shit.

We're like the Ferengi.

[albrecht]

But as Kelt says. If some bald statements are to be made, it's worthwhile making sure first.

Oh, I agree. The state of public education in the US is abysmal as more time is spend on weird politically-correct, revisionist history than the actual events. Also, I'm not saying we should not have fought in the various world wars, only that it was strictly necessary (unlike living in a country actually being invaded.)

Now the USA is being invaded and nobody will do anything about it except the odd rancher, but certainly this government doesn't seem to care. Indeed they seem to encourage the invasion and praise it.

[The General]

Do you really think we spend hundreds of billions of dollars to free people?

Yes.  Do I really think we should?  No.
Tell me what resources we were after in Korea and Vietnam?

[Yorkshire pud]

Yes.  Do I really think we should?  No.
Tell me what resources we were after in Korea and Vietnam?

That wasn't resources driven; It was the paranoia about Russia and China. And in Vietnam it was initially a 'Policing' status.

[PB the Deplorable]

Funny you should say that... http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/210810-immigration-group-plans-protest-in-house-office-building

Nature abhors a vacuum, weakness invites if not demands aggression.

[Foodlion]

Why would you see the oil? It isn't for US consumption. It's proceeds however are for US corporate consumption. Are you a big corporate player? I'm guessing not. Don't feel left out, you're in the same crowd as the other 99.999999999% of your fellow citizens.

That I did miss. Maybe I misunderstood on the whole oil war thing. I was told many times before that the war-oil conspiracy was to put another oil producing country back on the market to our favor. I also understand the whole supply + US. Dollar + forecast usage + forecast production + time of the year = cost of BBL of oil.  Since we all know the price of oil did in fact increase, then another logic would definitely make much more sense.

Thanks for shedding a little light on that.

[albrecht]

Nature abhors a vacuum, weakness invites if not demands aggression.

If the people protesting are illegal they should be arrested and deported. It is quite clear that Obama, and others of his ilk, don't want a secure border and are very encouraged by the flood across the border. We should have known this, well some of us did, when we learned how that character Obama has such a personal, vested interest in illegals. His own aunt was an illegal. His "dear aunty" also bilked public housing. Then we got that infamous drunk driver uncle who was an illegal. And who can forget when one of his brothers was refused entry into the UK due to a previous sex-charge (he was trying to enter under a false name.)

[The General]

That wasn't resources driven; It was the paranoia about Russia and China. And in Vietnam it was initially a 'Policing' status.

So fighting communism, which was responsible for an estimated 100 million deaths in the 20th century, was paranoia?  Ok then.  How was this not about liberty? Compare N Korea to S Korea if you're still confused.

[Yorkshire pud]

So fighting communism, which was responsible for an estimated 100 million deaths in the 20th century, was paranoia?  Ok then.  How was this not about liberty? Compare N Korea to S Korea if you're still confused.

Okay, wind your neck in.

Communism didn't cause 100 million deaths. The actions of a few disgusting psychopathic dictators did. Korea, there were Aussies, New Zealanders as well as Brits involved with the US troops. Consequently we have what we have now, I see no moves by anyone to 'free' the North Koreans, do you? As for the Vietnam war, it didn't  happen to 'free people', you really think that it did? It was a grotesque exercise in making the arms industry bigger and better to show the 'damn Commies' who the daddy was. If you really think it was 'a spreading US love' party, go over and wave the Stars and Stripes in the towns. Tell me how it goes.

[The General]

Okay, wind your neck in.

Communism didn't cause 100 million deaths.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_Communist_regimes

I see no moves by anyone to 'free' the North Koreans, do you?

To free North Korea would now mean nuclear war with China.  No thanks.

As for the Vietnam war, it didn't  happen to 'free people', you really think that it did?

It did til we left them high and dry.  Exactly like what just happened in Iraq.

[attachimg=1]

[Kelt]

During the Vietnam War, contrary to what many choose to believe, much of the resistance came from within the South Vietnamese populace, the demographic we were supposed to be 'Liberating'.

Vietnam was a case of choosing to fight a war out of what was perceived as America's self-interest, ie, to halt the spread of Communism, not to 'Liberate' Vietnamese.

I'll address the gorilla in the room for what it is here...

Many Americans suffer from 'Big Dick' Syndrome... where everything they do MUST be portrayed as altruistic, where everything they have MUST be USA NUMBER ONE!

So, if America goes half way round the world to invade a country it MUST be to Liberate rather than to secure resources... even if PNAC had openly stated this desire even before they assumed high profile positions within the government.  Even though there were dictators and atrocities much closer to home, resource-rich Iraq was simply chosen at random to be 'Liberated'.  That it was one of the most oil-rich states on the planet was never a consideration. It was an altruistic act of liberation.  You betcha. No self-interest involved.

If America fights for genuine freedom then America MUST have done most of the fighting, MUST have spent the most money, MUST have won the war single-handedly, and MUST have been the military with the biggest dicks.

If America makes a burrito it MUST be the best burrito, it MUST be the tastiest burrito, and it MUST be the burritoest burrito that ever went into a human mouth.

That's just how some folks are.

And bringing this up won't sit well with those particular sorts.

You just watch.

[The General]

If America makes a burrito it MUST be the best burrito, it MUST be the tastiest burrito, and it MUST be the burritoest burrito that ever went into a human mouth.

I'll have you know, sir, I make the world's best burritos.

[b_dubb]

Yes.  Do I really think we should?  No.
Tell me what resources we were after in Korea and Vietnam?

That war was the result of the Truman Doctrine.  The Communists tried to expand into the Korean peninsula. And the US wasn't the only military opposing the Communist forces.  Lots of Europeans died in that conflict.

[ItsOver]

mmmmmmm, burrito.  I want mine as a bean and ground beef, covered with a tasty chili gravy, topped with jalapenos and chopped onions, and some freshly made salsa. 

[Kelt]

That war was the result of the Truman Doctrine.  The Communists tried to expand into the Korean peninsula. And the US wasn't the only military opposing the Communist forces.  Lots of Europeans died in that conflict.

There were about 100,000 British troops deployed in Korea.

Not an insignificant military effort from a nation that was close to bankrupt following WW2.

Actions like Hill 235 have entered British military lore, though they're unknown outside of the UK.

If the British don't teach their own people about their own history then it's hardly surprising that non-Britons are unaware of British forces' involvement in these conflicts.

British kids tend to learn Greek, Roman, Egyptian, and a broad European and World history.  Actually focusing on Britain's own history seems to be something that just isn't done.

[onan]

I'll have you know, sir, I make the world's best burritos.

Bare knuckles out back... I make the best burritos.

[The General]

Bare knuckles out back... I make the best burritos.

Wait... why the aggression, man? 
Imagine if we were to combine forces. 
Burrito domination would be ours.

[onan]

Wait... why the aggression, man? 
Imagine if we were to combine forces. 
Burrito domination would be ours.

There can be only one.

[coaster]

Many Americans suffer from 'Big Dick' Syndrome... where everything they do MUST be portrayed as altruistic, where everything they have MUST be USA NUMBER ONE!

So, if America goes half way round the world to invade a country it MUST be to Liberate rather than to secure resources... even if PNAC had openly stated this desire even before they assumed high profile positions within the government.  Even though there were dictators and atrocities much closer to home, resource-rich Iraq was simply chosen at random to be 'Liberated'.  That it was one of the most oil-rich states on the planet was never a consideration. It was an altruistic act of liberation.  You betcha. No self-interest involved.

If America fights for genuine freedom then America MUST have done most of the fighting, MUST have spent the most money, MUST have won the war single-handedly, and MUST have been the military with the biggest dicks.

If America makes a burrito it MUST be the best burrito, it MUST be the tastiest burrito, and it MUST be the burritoest burrito that ever went into a human mouth.

That's just how some folks are.

And bringing this up won't sit well with those particular sorts.

You just watch.

Why don't you tell us how you really feel..

[The General]

There can be only one.

Alright, but don't say I didn't give you a chance.
I have secret ingredients that will definitely put any other burrito to shame.
It's the dried tears of brown people, serrano peppers, and crude oil.

[albrecht]

"I'm looking for something in an after-dinner burrito."
You can have your burritos. The chimichanga is where it's at. The goodness of a burrito with the added health and flavor of deep-frying.

[onan]

Alright, but don't say I didn't give you a chance.
I have secret ingredients that will definitely put any other burrito to shame.
It's the dried tears of brown people, serrano peppers, and crude oil.

Hey, that is the secret my momma taught me.