North Korea

[Sambo]

You think Rodney is an operative?  He's certainly an actor of the sorts?

Or here's another one. You think Kim is just a paid puppet? Some convenient bad dude for us westerners to loathe? A state run social experiment?

These days it's so easy to believe anything

[Yorkshire pud]

You think Rodney is an operative?  He's certainly an actor of the sorts?

Or here's another one. You think Kim is just a paid puppet? Some convenient bad dude for us westerners to loathe? A state run social experiment?

These days it's so easy to believe anything

Debate about it today on one of our radio shows..Last story I think, so be about an hour and three quarters in from 12 noon.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03nhc97

[West of the Rockies]

Well, at the risk of sounding very much like a conservative reactionary, I think the leader of North Korea is a fat-faced spoiled fuck who has no business in power.  He strikes me as cruel, capricious, twisted, and ignorant.  The sooner he strokes out or is deposed, the better.  I think it would be great to see North Korea join the modern world; I suspect its people are living in beyond-abject poverty.  I don't think it would be wise for the U.S. to try to "take him out", but I sure wish China would maybe decide it's time for a regime change.

[Yorkshire pud]

Well, at the risk of sounding very much like a conservative reactionary, I think the leader of North Korea is a fat-faced spoiled fuck who has no business in power.  He strikes me as cruel, capricious, twisted, and ignorant.  The sooner he strokes out or is deposed, the better.  I think it would be great to see North Korea join the modern world; I suspect its people are living in beyond-abject poverty.  I don't think it would be wise for the U.S. to try to "take him out", but I sure wish China would maybe decide it's time for a regime change.

It's possible something in that direction might be in the offing mate; The main state owned newspaper in China was critical of him after he murdered his uncle. Times are a changin perhaps.

[b_dubb]

North Korea has a problem with cannibalism because people are starving. I'm a pacifist but for this reason alone I would support a strike against NK purely on humanitarian grounds. 

[PB the Deplorable]

Well, at the risk of sounding very much like a conservative reactionary, I think the leader of North Korea is a fat-faced spoiled fuck who has no business in power.  He strikes me as cruel, capricious, twisted, and ignorant.  The sooner he strokes out or is deposed, the better.  I think it would be great to see North Korea join the modern world; I suspect its people are living in beyond-abject poverty.  I don't think it would be wise for the U.S. to try to "take him out", but I sure wish China would maybe decide it's time for a regime change.

His uncle was his link to the Chinese govt.  They are very concerned.

[Sambo]

Does NK have any major industry? Are they someone's Haiti perhaps? For geopolitical and corporate reasons we've supported ruthless dictators for generations

[b_dubb]

Does NK have any major industry? Are they someone's Haiti perhaps? For geopolitical and corporate reasons we've supported ruthless dictators for generations

Have you ever heard of the Korean War?

[West of the Rockies]

His uncle was his link to the Chinese govt.  They are very concerned.

Really?  Well, that sort of puts a damper on things for young Kim, doesn't it?  Pissing off the sleeping tiger is not a good idea when you're a plump little church mouse.

[Yorkshire pud]

Really?  Well, that sort of puts a damper on things for young Kim, doesn't it?  Pissing off the sleeping tiger is not a good idea when you're a plump little church mouse.

Not to mention that China has lots of incentive to keep the rest of the world sweet. NK isn't China's main concern I wouldn't have thought, apart from possible nukes.

[DigitalPigSnuggler]

North Korea has a problem with cannibalism because people are starving. 

The mismanagement of the country is evident wherever you look.  They just finished feeding Kim's uncle to 120 ravenous dogs.  You could have fed a whole NK village instead, but no. 

Simply appalling.

[General Johnson Jameson]

To those that are shade-tree DPRK researchers, here's an article that shows something important imo.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/11731735/Kim-Jong-un-pesticide-facility-may-double-as-weapon-factory.html

Now what you're thinking isn't what I'm going to point out. There are some key photos of Lil Kim in the news lately that document on-site visits to farms, factories, etc. Several times, as you can see in this article, he does not or has stopped wearing the Party pin. His wife was also recently photographed replaced her pin with a brooch.

What is important here, these pins signify social status and party loyalty in the DPRK. It's a long, forced tradition there. If you go out without your pin and are caught by State Security, unless you have family ranking you are likely off for a term in a re-education camp.

What's all this mean? Maybe nothing. There has been a rather large rise in the donju, or middle class among the society and their wealth has increased drastically vs that of the average North Koren. Perhaps eliminating the pin and the main ability to identify one's status is a move towards countering future social unrest and the rise of donju?

[albrecht]

To those that are shade-tree DPRK researchers, here's an article that shows something important imo.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/northkorea/11731735/Kim-Jong-un-pesticide-facility-may-double-as-weapon-factory.html

Now what you're thinking isn't what I'm going to point out. There are some key photos of Lil Kim in the news lately that document on-site visits to farms, factories, etc. Several times, as you can see in this article, he does not or has stopped wearing the Party pin. His wife was also recently photographed replaced her pin with a brooch.

What is important here, these pins signify social status and party loyalty in the DPRK. It's a long, forced tradition there. If you go out without your pin and are caught by State Security, unless you have family ranking you are likely off for a term in a re-education camp.

What's all this mean? Maybe nothing. There has been a rather large rise in the donju, or middle class among the society and their wealth has increased drastically vs that of the average North Koren. Perhaps eliminating the pin and the main ability to identify one's status is a move towards countering future social unrest and the rise of donju?

Whilst certainly bad it would seem that they are (if they are) making old-style stuff (much of that stuff is stuff used in WWI even!) Nasty but relatively only used tactically. Not a world or country killer. I'd be more wary of stuff that, maybe, other countries are experimenting with regard to race-based bioweapons or engineering of viruses that could wipe out a whole country's (or world's)  AG industry- like a super bird/swine flu or fungus to take out wheat, etc. I have a nasty mind but I would think taking out food supplies, tainting water, or an engineered "bug" even for humans would be a better method than chemical or nuclear because it could look "natural" and it would be hard to find culprit. I hope not! But I hope we are planning and studying for the possibility. I don't like all these Chinese, and others, in our universities learning and us exporting technology. I also don't like many of our drugs being made in factories in countries that are suspect (at least to standards, at worst potential outright enemies. Think if they decided to put something our prescriptions or vaccines?)

[General Johnson Jameson]

Whilst certainly bad it would seem that they are (if they are) making old-style stuff (much of that stuff is stuff used in WWI even!) Nasty but relatively only used tactically. Not a world or country killer. I'd be more wary of stuff that, maybe, other countries are experimenting with regard to race-based bioweapons or engineering of viruses that could wipe out a whole country's (or world's)  AG industry- like a super bird/swine flu or fungus to take out wheat, etc. I have a nasty mind but I would think taking out food supplies, tainting water, or an engineered "bug" even for humans would be a better method than chemical or nuclear because it could look "natural" and it would be hard to find culprit. I hope not! But I hope we are planning and studying for the possibility. I don't like all these Chinese, and others, in our universities learning and us exporting technology. I also don't like many of our drugs being made in factories in countries that are suspect (at least to standards, at worst potential outright enemies. Think if they decided to put something our prescriptions or vaccines?)

Did you even read what I wrote?

[Evil Twin Of Zen]

Did you even read what I wrote?

this link may serve better?  http://www.dailynk.com/english/read.php?cataId=nk01500&num=13306

[albrecht]

Did you even read what I wrote?

Yeah, but a 'Dear Leader' or their wives and families and connected people, can likely wear what they wish (dictators and royals often in the past make up medals and various accolades they "won" that are completely bogus.) Pins don't matter. You recall Obama even refused to wear the American flag pin that the media/politicians were forcing on each other by peer-pressure at the time. I'm more concerned with the chemical or biological weapons programs in that area, especially in relation to the technology we have given them and our large, corporatist agriculture industry.

[General Johnson Jameson]

Yeah, but a 'Dear Leader' or their wives and families and connected people, can likely wear what they wish (dictators and royals often in the past make up medals and various accolades they "won" that are completely bogus.) Pins don't matter. You recall Obama even refused to wear the American flag pin that the media/politicians were forcing on each other by peer-pressure at the time. I'm more concerned with the chemical or biological weapons programs in that area, especially in relation to the technology we have given them and our large, corporatist agriculture industry.

Not to be cruel, but you simply do not understand North Korea. In the DPRK, pins do matter and going to work without yours on may result in a bullet in one's head, depending on their standing. You don't seem to realize that his Father and especially Grandfather are Gods. They live on eternally despite being dead. To the Old Guard of the military that served his Grandfather, him showing up without the pin could be enough to ignite a coup.

It is so different than this fake-ass sign of patriotism with people in the U.S.that wear the American flag pin. If I were Obama, I wouldn't wear it either. It doesn't mean a damn thing. But in the DPRK, it's 100% different.

I'm not worried about them producing Bioweapons. The only real threat from this would be them exporting it and with all of the other nations with more evolved programs and their product on the market I highly doubt DPRK gets many calls for their mustard gas. It's irrelevant imo in an inter-Korean war as they would have Seoul leveled in under 30 minutes with the 50,000 artillery pieces carved into the mountains across the border. Remember, they supposedly have 10 nukes now by our latest estimates. Not that I believe that or that they yield more damage than an elephant fart, but needless to say they do have at least a few.

Also, there are many variations to the pin. If you are a nobody, your pin has a mute looking Kim Jong-Il with no smile. If you have high status, your pin has both Kim Jong-Il & Kim Il Sung with both smiling. This is really a deep and fucked up thing and I believe you've underestimated it's significance albrecht.

[General Johnson Jameson]

this link may serve better?  http://www.dailynk.com/english/read.php?cataId=nk01500&num=13306

Thank you for the Ri with brooch link Zen. Something's up there, I'm tellin ya.