Proof Conservatives Know They're Done

[albrecht]

Their discourse has become dumb and dumber every year (both parties and most talk hosts).  There is no honest discourse in this country anymore - everything is on an emotional (hyped-up) level.  As imperfect as it is, one has to look at foreign institutions such as the British Parliament to learn about and appreciate educated and intellectual discourse and debate in a government setting (with a peppering of partisan strategy).

You make the same mistake a lot of Americans make. Simply because someone has a nice accent they must be smarter or more educated. Sure you can tell if they went to the "right" schools by their accent but that doesn't mean their policies aren't wrong or that even their money bought that posh accent. But it is a reason why you see commercials using British spokesman. There are stupid and corrupt British politicians just as much (maybe more over time) than American politicians. There are smart people who talk with a southern drawl and dumb people. There are smart people who speak with a Boston accent, and dumb ones. It just depends where you were raised, what schools you attended, and what speech coaches you've had.

[PB the Deplorable]

... The money has already been printed; many of the cavebear conservatives on these boards fear it as devaluation of the dollar when, in fact, it will be currency of created value when we start up these new ventures. (The pie gets bigger...

If it's such a great idea to print all that money, why not print enough to give everyone $1 million dollars?  Hell, why not $10 or $100 million each?

Think of the 'currency of created value when we start up these new ventures' then.  Whatever that means.

... Get the damn money back into the economy: 
1) Banks that borrow from the Fed need to reduce their collateralization requirements on entrepreneurs...

Because loaning money to people to buy overpriced houses and who couldn't afford to pay it back worked so well from the early '00s right up to 2008?

... 2) An inheritance tax, to eliminate the growth of oligarchs and plutocrats...

Because when a person works their whole life working, saving, and investing, it really doesn't belong to them to pass along to their kids, it actually belongs to the government.

So all those opportunities to build small businesses you think are out there, well, after a person works their whole life to build them they should be sold and the proceeds confiscated as inheritance tax?

Same with everyone's farms and ranches?

Yeah, real incentive to start and build a business.  Everything actually belongs to the government, but you can keep what you manage to save after taxes - until you die.

Fascist.

... 3) 2 year moratorium on taxation and very limited regulation (safety only, really) for new ventures (provided they guarantee not to attempt to evade taxation later on by disincorporating/reincorporating as something else)...

Regs limited to safety only? 

What about pollution?  Or safeguards to prevent ripping people off?  Or your precious minimum wage?  Or all the rest of the regs that are actually valid and necessary?

... 4) Reduction of US corporate taxes from current 35% to 7% FLAT in exchange for new Federal Min Wage @ $15.00/hr.  (put the money into the hands of people who actually buy goods based on need)...

If a person is not worth $15/hr, they are not going to be hired at that rate.  That job will very likely simply disappear.  Has zero to do with a companies' income tax rate (when was the last time you saw an usher in the theatre, or had someone pump your gas and check you oil?).

Entry level wages are for people with low skills that need a place to start.  It' not meant to be a permanent wage for anyone, and no one earning min wage should be starting a family.


Here's a little secret about the minimum wage, and why the D's are really always woofing about it:  a lot of Union Contracts are tied to the min wage.  When it goes up, the hourly rate of those union members goes up.  It's not about some lowly wage earner, it's about more for much higher paid workers who mostly vote Dem, and whose unions provide a lot of cash and support for election campaigns.

... 5) Reformation of the commodities exchanges to full-interested parties only (25% money down, must take delivery of commodity purchased); end speculative pricing plays...

The speculators provide liquidity to those markets.  They also even out what would be spikes in the prices of the commodities contracts.

... This will push our economy back into growth mode; once we get past the notion that only 1% of us are smart enough to run this thing then we will see amazing innovation and expanded opportunity.

The whole 1%er thing is just a meme made up by Obama/Soros/Occupy to divide the country further and to use as a propaganda weapon for the sorts of unhelpful policies you advocate.  As you are doing now, using it as a red herring about only 1% of us running the economy.

I already debunked the 1% thing months ago when I pointed out they are mostly entertainers, ball players, politicians, and people with farms and small businesses.  If you mean Wall St Bankers and top executives in international companies, say so.


You are right if you mean we all - everyone - together make millions of decisions every day, and each transaction is made with the idea it benefits both parties.  But I don't think you mean that.

The baker selling a loaf of bread is better off selling it for $3 than not selling it.  The customer would rather have that loaf of bread than the $3.  Both benefited, a tiny bit of wealth was created during that exchange.  And so it goes throughout the economy.

The problem is the Left - the 'Progressives' - DO believe 1% of the population should be making all the decisions.  Just not 'the rich'.  Or the Market.  They think government should be making all decisions for everyone.

Want proof?  Go back and read your own post

[Marc.Knight]

You make the same mistake a lot of Americans make. Simply because someone has a nice accent they must be smarter or more educated. Sure you can tell if they went to the "right" schools by their accent but that doesn't mean their policies aren't wrong or that even their money bought that posh accent. But it is a reason why you see commercials using British spokesman. There are stupid and corrupt British politicians just as much (maybe more over time) than American politicians. There are smart people who talk with a southern drawl and dumb people. There are smart people who speak with a Boston accent, and dumb ones. It just depends where you were raised, what schools you attended, and what speech coaches you've had.

I'm less concerned with how people sound, such as with an accent, and more concerned with their demeanor.  Other societies support a greater degree of civil discourse than ours does.  We are quickly moving away from using logic to deal with issues and are now jumping straight to emotional, polarized reactions. 

[Kelt]

Would it help if we invaded Iraq again?

I lean Liberatedâ,,¢, obviously.

Nothing unifies the country like bombing brown folks.

I already have a picture of a weeping eagle atop an American flag ready to go as my avatar, just to show how on board I am and how I'll 'never forget' that those fucking Iraqis.... well, whatever it is they did, I forget now.

But I will, you know NEVER forget.

regardless, the eagle is crying, so someone needs a rocket up the ass.

[ItsOver]

I just spent over a half hour at the local post office trying to get my mail from some arrogant morons.  Just what I want, even more screwed-up government-related entities to deal with.

[Quick Karl]

Nothing unifies the country like bombing brown folks.

Cry me a river.

What do you call it when the Spanish invaded Central and South America and slaughtered the aboriginal Peoples - Justice?

You have a historical grasp that is about 30-seconds long, and so fucking bi-assed that it is sickening.

[Robert Ghostwolf's Ghost]

You make the same mistake a lot of Americans make. Simply because someone has a nice accent they must be smarter or more educated. Sure you can tell if they went to the "right" schools by their accent but that doesn't mean their policies aren't wrong or that even their money bought that posh accent. But it is a reason why you see commercials using British spokesman. There are stupid and corrupt British politicians just as much (maybe more over time) than American politicians. There are smart people who talk with a southern drawl and dumb people. There are smart people who speak with a Boston accent, and dumb ones. It just depends where you were raised, what schools you attended, and what speech coaches you've had.

Not necessarily.  I bet if Sarah Palin had an accent that sounded refined and cultured instead of her grating, braying, singsong inflections, she'd be the incumbent president today.  Incumbent, because there is no doubt in my mind that she would have found a way to off McCain--poisoned sandwich, a subtle hip check while passing on the stairs, putting on a Charles Keating mask and yelling "Boo!" while jumping out of a closet, just to name a few--before he'd reached his first hundred days in office.

[Kelt]

[in reference to people being killed] Cry me a river.

so·ci·o·path
ˈsōsēōˌpaTH/Submit
noun
a person with a personality disorder manifesting itself in extreme antisocial attitudes and behavior and a lack of conscience.

Oh.

Snap.

What do you call it when the Spanish invaded Central and South America and slaughtered the aboriginal Peoples - Justice?

Um... are you under the impression that I have any desire or motivation to defend the Spanish conquests in the Americas?

Because, you should probably be made aware, I don't.

So, that.

You have a historical grasp that is about 30-seconds long, and so fucking bi-assed that it is sickening.

I'm pretty sure my grasp of history... world history, mind, not what passes for an education in history in the US... is somewhat greater than your own. 

[VtaGeezer]

Cry me a river.

What do you call it when the Spanish invaded Central and South America and slaughtered the aboriginal Peoples - Justice?

I call it the 16th Century.  Got a calender? 

[Jackstar]

there is no doubt in my mind that she would have found a way to off McCain--poisoned sandwich, a subtle hip check while passing on the stairs, putting on a Charles Keating mask and yelling "Boo!" while jumping out of a closet, just to name a few--before he'd reached his first hundred days in office.

[Quick Karl]

I call it the 16th Century.  Got a calender?

If a hot blonde doesn't want to fuck you, because you're an asshole, it doesn't make her a racist, because you're brown or black or whatever the fuck.

It's because you're an asshole.

Capisci?

[VtaGeezer]

If a hot blonde doesn't want to fuck you, because you're an asshole, it doesn't make her a racist, because you're brown or black or whatever the fuck.

It's because you're an asshole.

Capisci?

WTF are you going on about now?

[Catsmile]

WTF are you going on about now?

Something about blondes won't peg his ass, because he's an asshole?

[kf5iwe]

I am a conservative. WE ARE NOT DONE

[onan]

I am a conservative. WE ARE NOT DONE

You may not be done, but unless your party can find a way to be more inclusive, you're certainly on the back burner.

[Quick Karl]

Something about blondes won't peg his ass, because he's an asshole?

Dam nit, you are discriminating against me because I am heterosexual, and proud of it, and I am white!!!!

You fucking Catholic child molester.

[Jackstar]

Dam nit, you are discriminating against me because I am heterosexual, and proud of it, and I am white!!!!

Is it really something to be... proud of? Think this one over for a moment.

You fucking Catholic child molester.

I don't get it. Has this been, like, declassified? Also, I really don't know who you're actually talking to. Are you on drugs? Tell me you're on drugs. Apparently this matters almost as much as oil.

[Quick Karl]

Is it really something to be... proud of? Think this one over for a moment.

I don't get it. Has this been, like, declassified? Also, I really don't know who you're actually talking to. Are you on drugs? Tell me you're on drugs. Apparently this matters almost as much as oil.

I am proud of who I am as a human person, but narrow-minded juvenile stupidity enrages me, especially when it is painted as infallible rational intellectualism. I try to shine my own kind of light on it.

I am the light.

[Jackstar]

Okay, but that's a totally different statement.

Pretty quick, Karl! =D

[PB the Deplorable]

Yes, entrepreneurs are having a difficult time securing financing from the very institutions that didn't think twice about creating CDO's.

That's a crime.  (Especially since lending institutions have had to pay a pittance for capital from the Fed window for half a decade now.) Money should be pouring into solid business plans and shouldn't have to face severe collateralization (ironic, isn't it...) to expand economic activity.

The money has already been printed; many of the cavebear conservatives on these boards fear it as devaluation of the dollar when, in fact, it will be currency of created value when we start up these new ventures. (The pie gets bigger - something conservatives absolutely hate.)

The fruition of so much creation will be capitalization on the exchanges.  Growing companies will offer investors (retirement planners) opportunities for steady income for decades.

We need to create new businesses.  Many of ourexisting companies are lazy; rather than spiriited competition they merge and streamline.  No growth there.  No innovation there...

3) 2 year moratorium on taxation and very limited regulation (safety only, really) for new ventures (provided they guarantee not to attempt to evade taxation later on by disincorporating/reincorporating as something else)....

Regulations are there for a reason.  They do a couple of things.  They are meant to round off the excesses of Capitalism - an imperfect system, but by doing so they each slow the economy to a certain extent.  It's a tradeoff.

Yes we want clean air and water, fair labor laws, food safety and all the rest.  We understand this comes at a cost, and we are very willing to accept it.

The costs and benefits of each regulation should be considered before they are implemented.  Unfortunately, for some, the benefits to them are an issue they can demagogue for votes, and it costs them nothing - many of these cost customers, employees, and the company a lot but not those implementing them.  These are the regulations that should be done away with, or not implemented in the first place.


If a regulation is worth having, it should apply to all the businesses in the field being regulated, including start-ups.  If it isn't worth implementing for start-ups, maybe it should be done away with for everyone.

[NowhereInTime]

Regulations are there for a reason.  They do a couple of things.  They are meant to round off the excesses of Capitalism - an imperfect system, but by doing so they each slow the economy to a certain extent.  It's a tradeoff.

Yes we want clean air and water, fair labor laws, food safety and all the rest.  We understand this comes at a cost, and we are very willing to accept it.

The costs and benefits of each regulation should be considered before they are implemented.  Unfortunately, for some, the benefits to them are an issue they can demagogue for votes, and it costs them nothing - many of these cost customers, employees, and the company a lot but not those implementing them.  These are the regulations that should be done away with, or not implemented in the first place.


If a regulation is worth having, it should apply to all the businesses in the field being regulated, including start-ups.  If it isn't worth implementing for start-ups, maybe it should be done away with for everyone.

One of the consistent call outs for why new businesses fail is the burdensome nature of regulation.  When you are trying to manage a startup, you need to develop a consistent method of operation with a regular flow of production, sales, service, vendor operations, etc. 
To be concerned with the Zoning Inspector one day, the Health Inspector the next, the Unemployment Insurance review sent to your off ice after that, the OSHA inspector next week, the Fire Inspector (who, I don't care what business (or what part of the country) you are in, will always complain about something, the State Revenue Department, Homeland Security, the EPA (even though you don't have toxic chemicals), and here comes Inland Wetlands...
The point being that before opening this is all handled; once open, there doesn't need to be immediate follow up except on complaint, but you'd be surprised how many agencies walk in your door as you are working on development.
Maybe two years is two long; maybe just a year, but give an operation a chance to get into flow before compliance checks.  (It isn't "either/or", it's nuance.  We've had this discussion.)
I agree regulation is needed to protect society for overlooked problems or malfeasance, and also agree that prevention is a better medicine, but to cause a business distress to the point where it loses focus off operational mission causes a negative impact to any community.

[NowhereInTime]

I just spent over a half hour at the local post office trying to get my mail from some arrogant morons.  Just what I want, even more screwed-up government-related entities to deal with.

They changed my post office from the one two bocks away to one six miles away.  You know why? "To save fuel."  No bullshit.
Pensions are not why the Post Office is failing; management is.

[albrecht]

They changed my post office from the one two bocks away to one six miles away.  You know why? "To save fuel."  No bullshit.
Pensions are not why the Post Office is failing; management is.

- The Post Office no longer receives direct government support (aside from subsidy for FPO for primarily military use) but yet must pay in and maintain their pension scheme and all the pensioners from back when it was a government entity. And work with the various unions of postal employees. But their competitors don't have to deal with pensions or unions. In a way it surprises me that USPS is still, usually, cheaper to deliver packages than their competitors.
-The Post Office is poorly managed, as you mention, when facing downturn in revenue their solution is to raise prices, especially of 1st class stamps. They also won't innovate. They could try to get into financial services more (like European post offices do) for the elderly, poor, and so-called "working class" people (process their benefit payments, basic checking account, money xfers, etc.)

[PB the Deplorable]

The Post Office in my town - and perhaps other places? - took out the stamp vending machines that were in the lobby.  I asked why and one of them told me it was the Postmasters idea that if we stood in line and enedup up at the counter, we might spend more money on other things.

I haven't been in since, and buy the few stamps I use at the store - who get a commission from the PO for selling them at face value.  Screw the Post Office.


PS, I very much doubt they are managed worse than the rest of the Federal Govt

[Mind Flayer Monk]

But their competitors don't have to deal with pensions or unions. In a way it surprises me that USPS is still, usually, cheaper to deliver packages than their competitors.

The post office carries most of the packages for competitors UPS and Fed Ex. UPS and Fed Ex both have incredibly strong unions as well. UPS and Fed Ex only carry the high margin packages themselves. We won't see any changes at the Post Office as long as Amazon is around-it is a constant cash cow for the post office.

[Robert Ghostwolf's Ghost]

Seen and raised.

http://31.media.tumblr.com/62db3e1060b07d95bf8f19d03568218b/tumblr_mpwog6WKGM1s710r1o1_500.gif

[ItsOver]

I wish there was an alternative to the USPS for general mail service.  My day-to-day mail delivery really isn't a problem.  It's when I have to deal with the local post office, which I try to avoid, if at all possible.  The employees are usually surly, slow, disinterested, and seem to be generally indifferent to customer satisfaction, the usual result when there is a disconnect between personnel performance and  job retention, from top to bottom.

I'm sure there are exceptions.  I would expect the small-town type PO's to be more customer friendly but I'm in a major metro area where, unfortunately, my local PO just sucks.  Also, unfortunately, I have no altervatives for some services.  That's what I really hate about any government-related service. If the provided service sucks, I can't easily vote with my feet, short of moving.  You're just screwed.  I'm glad there's not just one provider of toilet paper.

[albrecht]

I wish there was an alternative to the USPS for general mail service.  My day-to-day mail delivery really isn't a problem.  It's when I have to deal with the local post office, which I try to avoid, if at all possible.  The employees are usually surly, slow, disinterested, and seem to be generally indifferent to customer satisfaction, the usual result when there is a disconnect between personnel performance and  job retention, from top to bottom.

I'm sure there are exceptions.  I would expect the small-town type PO's to be more customer friendly but I'm in a major metro area where, unfortunately, my local PO just sucks.  Also, unfortunately, I have no altervatives for some services.  That's what I really hate about any government-related service. If the provided service sucks, I can't vote with my feet.  Your're just screwed.  I'm glad there's not just one provider of toilet paper.

There are exceptions. I've found if I go just about a 1/2 mile in a different direction I get a post office that is on the outskirts of town, hardly ever busy but when busy line flows quickly, and the workers are friendly and even remember you. If I go to the one more in town it is slower, the workers are not less motivated but still friendly, etc. If I go to the downtown branch it is often, oddly, closed at random times for "team meetings" (handwritten sign "back by 11:30" and it is noon), the workers are often talking amongst themselves- or on their cellphones- while the line backs up, and the workers look like a poster for affirmative action (and this is in a town that is primarily white/hispanic) in one case I had to help affix labels because the worker's nails were so long and brightly colored she could not manipulate the label.)

[Stellar]

Your "principles" resonate with the American People with a resounding thud.  You can't win the argument, so you resort to tricks like this:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2014/02/06/national-republican-congressional-campaign-using-fake-democrat-websites-to-lure-voters/?hpt=hp_t1

Pathetic.

Funny how the pack mentality actually still believes two parties or more exist where in the popular vote you think you have some actual F_ing choice. In this the long list of responses here I hope someone has already stated the reality of choosing leaders which really is not in the hands of the rabble, so obvious.  Are you high I mean really do you think the elite and all these puppet master secret societies are going to let you choose their tyrant.  Ok I just got out of the Out House and its not White; I have to tell you that smells better than this thread.

Transparent- "New World Order"

[Stellar]

More proof for example:  Presidents chosen not elected, but I know your minds are electacuted, opps I mean embedded in CNN! oh that's right the voters are hanging from the electorate chad tribbles or Maybe they just count 9 votes in reality! And you almost have to be a Tribillinaire to wire your vote into a Judicial member hmmm! Now we understand the election process wow I'm sweating chad back to the white house, I'm mean out house!

Bush v. Gore: 2000 election vote in Florida resolved by the Supreme Court

George W. Bush - Skull and Bones: "It's So Secret We Can't Talk About It"