Coast may lose their NY affiliate

[albrecht]

Are these "events" like the new age seminars and alternative fairs and festivals? If so, I have no respect for what is left of the show. Hard to tell which came first- the decline of the show and need for other outlets OR the pursuit of other outlets at the cost of the show. 

I think so. Some of the "events" seem to be titled like things about UFOs etc but judging from the pictures and guests I'm guessing a lot of the actual action and people are things like tarot card readers, "alternative" health stuff, channelers, vitamin and supplement sales, and new age blather.

[pate]

Is that what the kids are calling it these days?

...making notes in a little book (*won't call out the color, that'd be racist...*)...

[pyewacket]

I think so. Some of the "events" seem to be titled like things about UFOs etc but judging from the pictures and guests I'm guessing a lot of the actual action and people are things like tarot card readers, "alternative" health stuff, channelers, vitamin and supplement sales, and new age blather.

I helped out an acquaintance who had a booth at these events for a few of them and got to see it from another perspective. I'm all for fun, I read cards on occasion and would never think of charging anyone. I always said it was to entertain only! I don't do this sort of thing as a living as some do. The people I observed attending these fairs and seeking advice for real problems from card readers, aura pictures, psychics, alternative (very expensive) natural supplements, and "doctors" of whatever (attended a weekend seminar to get "certified") were eating it up! Some seemed so sad and desperate, but the vendors happily took their money. It really made me sick and cured me of any curiosity I had about this sort of thing. It was also obvious that this person was using me and others as free labor. LOL Nothing supernatural about that! From what I understand, in some states they have Anti-Divination Laws but they are being repealed little by little.

Here's an interesting article:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/11/04/recent-psychic-fraud-trials-in-ny-florida-expose-line-between-fortunetelling/

[albrecht]

I helped out an acquaintance who had a booth at these events for a few of them and got to see it from another perspective. I'm all for fun, I read cards on occasion and would never think of charging anyone. I always said it was to entertain only! I don't do this sort of thing as a living as some do. The people I observed attending these fairs and seeking advice for real problems from card readers, aura pictures, psychics, alternative (very expensive) natural supplements, and "doctors" of whatever (attended a weekend seminar to get "certified") were eating it up! Some seemed so sad and desperate, but the vendors happily took their money. It really made me sick and cured me of any curiosity I had about this sort of thing. It was also obvious that this person was using me and others as free labor. LOL Nothing supernatural about that! From what I understand, in some states they have Anti-Divination Laws but they are being repealed little by little.

Here's an interesting article:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/11/04/recent-psychic-fraud-trials-in-ny-florida-expose-line-between-fortunetelling/

Yeah. And many, if not most, take pains to say "for entertainment" or for the herbs and "alternative" medicine that FDA not approved, "not giving medical advice", etc. It is a tough call where to draw the line. I know, or at least have heard of, people who've been going to psychologists for decades. There are many different types and theories (and not scientifically "testable") if you are going to one for years and years are they helping you- or bilking you? Maybe simply talking to someone or believing in something can help people? Even psychiatry has problems testing scientifically (note the reports about various drugs whose efficacy has been called into question- though clearly for some conditions certain drugs do help people.)

Then again when it crosses the line: whether church or gypsy fortune teller or newage guru or cult- to where you are giving substantial amounts of money and your "cure" keeps increasing in costs, where you get caught up in pyramid schemes, when you have to keep escalating your visits and costs to get the cure or advice. I guess that is where juries and judges can come in because a strict "law" seems, to me, to be over-board. What about priests? What about pastors? What about psychologists? Etc. How "much" should you be encouraged to give, or pay? Why do some psychologists charge more than others (and some approaching lawyer-type fees?) I would think we use current civil and criminal stuff already on the books and common-law for fraud and not "ban" new-age, gypsies, (or whatever.)

Btw: a few years back a "Gypsy King" died and there was a whole rigamarole about it. He was quite (in)famous and won a lawsuit against the city of Spokane. The article is interesting because it details, a bit, there life. Gypsies, or Roma, came in from all over the place to celebrate his funeral (apparently Gypsies "celebrate" after someone dies and cry over being born. Considering their past of being persecuted that doesn't surprise me.) There are bilkers and some argue that much of what they do is just that. Then again it always sort of impressed me how they could keep their language, culture, etc)
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/may/23/celebrating-a-gypsys-life-romani-hold-traditional/

[pyewacket]

Yeah. And many, if not most, take pains to say "for entertainment" or for the herbs and "alternative" medicine that FDA not approved, "not giving medical advice", etc. It is a tough call where to draw the line. I know, or at least have heard of, people who've been going to psychologists for decades. There are many different types and theories (and not scientifically "testable") if you are going to one for years and years are they helping you- or bilking you? Maybe simply talking to someone or believing in something can help people? Even psychiatry has problems testing scientifically (note the reports about various drugs whose efficacy has been called into question- though clearly for some conditions certain drugs do help people.)

Then again when it crosses the line: whether church or gypsy fortune teller or newage guru or cult- to where you are giving substantial amounts of money and your "cure" keeps increasing in costs, where you get caught up in pyramid schemes, when you have to keep escalating your visits and costs to get the cure or advice. I guess that is where juries and judges can come in because a strict "law" seems, to me, to be over-board. What about priests? What about pastors? What about psychologists? Etc. How "much" should you be encouraged to give, or pay? Why do some psychologists charge more than others (and some approaching lawyer-type fees?) I would think we use current civil and criminal stuff already on the books and common-law for fraud and not "ban" new-age, gypsies, (or whatever.)

Btw: a few years back a "Gypsy King" died and there was a whole rigamarole about it. He was quite (in)famous and won a lawsuit against the city of Spokane. The article is interesting because it details, a bit, there life. Gypsies, or Roma, came in from all over the place to celebrate his funeral (apparently Gypsies "celebrate" after someone dies and cry over being born. Considering their past of being persecuted that doesn't surprise me.) There are bilkers and some argue that much of what they do is just that. Then again it always sort of impressed me how they could keep their language, culture, etc)
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/may/23/celebrating-a-gypsys-life-romani-hold-traditional/

They are revising or eliminating some of the laws because of religious freedom or free speech issues. Anything can be abused- it's a matter of personal judgement on the part of the consumer. I imagine people who make their living this way would like to see the frauds dealt with to protect people. Not all are schemers and many people enjoy this pastime. People can be taken advantage of by churches and other groups just as easily.

Nothing wrong with holding a belief, especially if it helps a person cope.

[albrecht]

They are revising or eliminating some of the laws because of religious freedom or free speech issues. Anything can be abused- it's a matter of personal judgement on the part of the consumer. I imagine people who make their living this way would like to see the frauds dealt with to protect people. Not all are schemers and many people enjoy this pastime. People can be taken advantage of by churches and other groups just as easily.

Nothing wrong with holding a belief, especially if it helps a person cope.

I'm for the repeal. Real abuse can be protected against by general fraud statutes, laws against fake medicine, tax laws, and civil lawsuits. If the person is an adult and in their right-mind you should be able to believe, and buy, just about whatever you want.
I think one reason many of these people had laws against them (or persecutions) is because much of their businesses are historically "cash" and sort of "off the books" and the governments never like that.

[pate]

Not sure what exactly y'all are talking about, but what is for sale?  The seller always has that in a true free market.   The buyer needs only wait, unless the buyer advertises for the buy.  So I suppose the sellers, or perhaps the product should be watched...  Say I want Ebola infected bushmeat.  As a buyer of that product the red flags are up...  Say I have bushmeat that happens to be infected, well I don't need to state that, I could just say I have bushmeat for sale, a discreet inquiriy on the buyers part either gets the product sought or a report to the authourities (assuming the seller is reputable...) buyer with scruples is screwd, seller without has the market in hand...


So you watch the sellers mostly, a 'sting' or two (three four who's counting?) bags the consumer,  but the one you want is the seller...

Snake oil?  Heh, I happen to have a fresh squeezed batch &etc...  Or is it fresh emu or ostrich eggs you want?  Whichever, the seller is more inclined to diversify, the buyer is usually in a specific, unless you run into the rare bird that sets up as a market, you need tiger meat? I have a buyer for whichever, those cats get caught fast, but not that fast the haul from those types is nice usually...